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HCP Roundtable: Breaking Barriers and Cultivating Clinical Excellence in Endometrial Cancer Care

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HCP Roundtable: Breaking Barriers and Cultivating Clinical Excellence in Endometrial Cancer Care from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

What are obstacles faced by healthcare providers (HCPs) treating endometrial cancer patients and families? How can HCPs foster a culture of innovation and continuous improvement in clinical practice? Dr. Radhika Gogoi of Karmanos Cancer Institute and Dr. Charlotte Gamble of MedStar Health unravel the complexities of endometrial cancer care, providing HCPs with the insights and tools needed to navigate challenges effectively and to deliver optimal care to their patients and families.

See More from EPEP Endometrial Cancer

Related Resources:

Dr. Charlotte Gamble: Why Is It Important for You to Empower Patients

Dr. Charlotte Gamble: Why Is It Important for You to Empower Patients?

 Addressing Disparities in Gynecologic Oncology | Key Challenges and Solutions

Addressing Disparities in Gynecologic Oncology | Key Challenges and Solutions

 Overcoming Barriers: Empowering Underrepresented Groups With Endometrial Cancer

Overcoming Barriers: Empowering Underrepresented Groups With Endometrial Cancer

Transcript:

Dr. Nicole Rochester:

Welcome to this Empowering Providers to Empower Patients or EPEP Program. I’m Dr. Nicole Rochester, founder and CEO of Your GPS Doc. EPEP is a Patient Empowerment Network program that serves as a secure space for healthcare providers to learn techniques for improving physician patient communication and to overcome practice barriers. In this endometrial cancer healthcare provider roundtable, we are discussing breaking barriers and cultivating clinical excellence in endometrial cancer care. 

This program aims to improve healthcare provider awareness of screening and access disparities to specialized care in endometrial cancer, while also addressing solutions to overcome practice barriers such as lack of awareness, outdated practices, and inertia. Today, we’ll talk about some of the complexities of endometrial cancer care and we’ll provide healthcare providers with the insights and tools needed to navigate challenges effectively.

Our discussion will cover enhancing healthcare provider awareness of diagnostic and access disparities to specialized care in endometrial cancer, actionable strategies to overcome practice barriers in endometrial cancer care and empowering providers through fostering a culture of innovation and continuous improvement in clinical practice. 

It is my privilege to be joined by Dr. Radhika Gogoi from Karmanos Cancer Institute. Dr. Gogoi is a dedicated clinician and cancer researcher focused on exploring the Hippo pathway in gynecologic cancers, aiming to uncover novel therapeutic approaches. Thank you so much for joining us today, Dr. Gogoi.

Dr. Radhika Gogoi:

Thank you, Dr. Rochester, and thank you for having me. It’s great to be here.

Dr. Nicole Rochester:

It’s also my honor to be joined by Dr. Charlotte Gamble, gynecologic oncologist at MedStar Washington Hospital Center and MedStar Southern Maryland Hospital. Dr. Gamble is dedicated to taking care of patients who have historically been marginalized and are vulnerable to poor health outcomes. Her research examines the role of safety net hospital systems in gynecologic cancer care. Thank you so much for joining us today, Dr. Gamble.

Dr. Charlotte Gamble:

Thank you so much for having me. It’s a pleasure to be here.

Dr. Nicole Rochester:

So we’re going to start today’s discussion by diving into enhancing healthcare provider awareness of diagnostic and access disparities in endometrial cancer care. And I want to start by just framing the current situation. Black women are twice as likely to die from endometrial cancer when compared to their white women counterparts.

There is no current screening test for endometrial cancer, and diagnosis is usually made after patients present with symptoms. Sadly, the list doesn’t end there. So I’m going to start with you, Dr. Gogoi. What are the primary barriers to accessing specialized care for endometrial cancer that you’ve observed in your practice and perhaps in others?

Dr. Radhika Gogoi:

So thank you for that question. I guess I just want to start by just level setting a little bit and talking about specifically endometrial cancer disparities. So unlike other gynecologic cancers, which actually have been shown to be decreasing in incidence, endometrial cancer is actually one of the cancers that is increasing. We know that low grade endometrial cancers really have an excellent prognosis, but higher grade endometrial cancers really have a much poorer prognosis.

And that’s the specific subgroup that seems to be increasing in all women. Black women, again, as you mentioned, have the lowest survival rate, and that is even when corrected for the specific type of endometrial cancer and the stage of endometrial cancer. So with that sort of background and problem, the question really becomes how do we allow and educate our patients about the barriers that they face when accessing specialized care?

And so some of the barriers, at least that I’ve noticed, and certainly in the hospital that I practice in is really as you pointed out, that there is no good current screening test. Black women tend to have a delayed onset from the time of their symptoms, which in this case is really postmenopausal bleeding to actually obtaining a diagnosis.

And there are studies that have shown that some of that is education or there is an understanding that perhaps postmenopausal bleeding is not as significant an issue, doesn’t lead necessarily, to obtaining healthcare which as you can appreciate then delays the onset of the diagnosis. There is also that Black women present with more advanced disease. This is, again, likely due to the delay in diagnosis and the delay from diagnosis to getting treated.

Dr. Nicole Rochester:

Thank you. Thank you, Dr. Gogoi for level setting and for getting us started with a better understanding of those disparities. And I’d love to go to you, Dr. Gamble. In your experience, what are the primary barriers to addressing specialized care for endometrial cancer?

Dr. Charlotte Gamble:

Yeah, thank you so much.  I’ll just add some additional context. I think there are so many places in which these barriers can happen. So as Dr. Gogoi alluded to, sometimes that can happen at the patient level due to just not recognizing that having irregular, unpredictable bleeding, bleeding after menopause, bleeding even before menopause has happened, but really heavy bleeding or heavy periods that any sort of abnormal, heavy irregular bleeding is not normal and has to be evaluated in a timely fashion. But that’s at the patient level.

And sometimes, people have competing priorities where they might recognize that it’s a problem but not be able to make it to their doctor’s office. Have other kinds of things that are happening in their day-to-day lives where they just are not able to prioritize their own health. We also see then how the system can affect that.

If someone hasn’t had a gynecologist in years, or their gynecologist said, bye, you don’t need to see me anymore because you’re over the age of 65, you no longer need pap smears and they’ve fallen out of care, or patients who don’t have health insurance or patients who live really far away from their doctors. Accessing the healthcare system in the year of our Lord 2024 is actually really, really hard. If you lack the resources or lack the wherewithal to navigate that.

Additionally, what we see on the healthcare standpoint is that maybe patients do actually access the healthcare system. They call the gynecologist’s office. They call their primary care doctor, and they’re told by an admin staff or someone else that hears them, but that says, okay, fine, we’ll get you in, but it’s going to be in about three-and-a-half months.

And so sometimes those barriers and those delays come from the health system in general, which is also a challenge. And then even after they present to their doctor, sometimes they’re told, “Okay, let’s go ahead and let’s get an ultrasound first, and based on what your ultrasound looks like, then we’ll decide if we need to do a uterine biopsy to diagnose you.” But we also know that for certain types of these uterine cancers, specifically the really aggressive ones, that sometimes their ultrasound might look totally fine, but there still can be cancer underlying there.

And so I think that there are multiple barriers to getting even. That’s before the diagnosis even happens much less what comes after the diagnosis is had, how one gets from their gynecologist to a surgical subspecialist called the gynecological oncologist that Dr. Gogoi and I, this is our field. And there are multiple barriers and referral pathways there. But that’s to give a little bit more context that these things might start at the patient level, but the healthcare system, unfortunately, can contribute in rarely challenging ways to the barriers that patients face.

Dr. Nicole Rochester:

Thank you both for that. I think we have a really good idea of the breadth of this issue, and I appreciate both of you pointing out that there are patient level factors, but there are also system level factors that come into play. And, Dr. Gamble, you just kind of ended by talking about referrals.

So I’m going to pick up there. And let’s talk about referral patterns. And I’ll start with you for this question. How do those referral patterns impact access to specialized care gynecologic oncologists like yourself and Dr. Gogoi for women who are diagnosed with endometrial cancer and specifically for those underserved populations?

Dr. Charlotte Gamble:

Yeah, this is a complicated question and multi-layered. Again, I think big picture referral patterns. We know that there are barriers for patients who live rurally. We know there are barriers for patients who don’t have insurance or their insurance might be, they might be underinsured. And so there’s kind of system level barriers that we see on the macro level in some of our referral pathways.

And occasionally, sometimes patients with gynecologic cancers will actually be referred to not gynecologic oncologists, which are surgical subspecialists that work specifically with gynecologic malignancies, but might be referred to a general surgeon first, or a general gynecologist who may or may not know kind of what they’re getting into in terms of the care. I think what I’ve noticed in real life is that when I’m getting referrals, sometimes I’m getting a text message, sometimes I’m getting an email, sometimes getting a message in the medical record system, and the referrals are coming in many different ways.

Occasionally, patients are calling themselves. And so the ways that referrals actually then happen in real life and how those spread to kind of the macro levels is really interesting to me. It can be very complicated, very complex, and I think this is where the role of having healthcare navigators comes into play where folks can really assist patients in getting to the right surgical subspecialists.

Dr. Nicole Rochester:

Absolutely. And we know there’s a lot of evidence for the role of healthcare navigators in other disease spaces and specifically in cancer. So I appreciate you mentioning that. We’ve talked a little bit about patient level factors, and we’ve talked about system level factors. We haven’t talked a lot about maybe some provider level factors.

And I want to talk about cultural competency and the role that that plays in addressing disparities in endometrial cancer, specifically with regard to diagnosis. And I’m going to start with you, Dr. Gogoi on this one. And if you can share the role that you believe cultural competency plays in addressing some of these disparities that we’ve been talking about.

Dr. Radhika Gogoi:

Yeah, so I think you heard from us a little bit that oftentimes some of the symptoms that our patients have had are either ignored, or patients haven’t had a chance to fully address them, or the providers haven’t fully evaluated kind of the importance of their symptoms. And I think, so again, I think nurse navigators community educators are essential in sort of educating our communities about the importance of seeking care when you have sort of the symptoms that Dr. Gamble talked about and in a really timely fashion. I think that that’s really important as well.

So I think it obviously, cultural competency is important in sort of all facets of a patient’s journey as they kind of have the diagnosis through their treatment. But I think that the other place is really once they enter the healthcare system being aware and mindful of sort of healthcare mistrust both from the provider, from the institution, from a much larger governmental level and being aware of that distrust and really trying to take time to address their concerns.

That specifically at least comes up a lot in terms of clinical trials where we know that minority populations, Black patients are met vastly underrepresented. And so I think specifically in that area, there is really the opportunity to do a much better job in providing transparency about the trial design, about recruiting specifically minority patients. Interestingly, a lot of these landmark trials actually didn’t include race as a measure. And so we know that they’re underrepresented, but we actually don’t know how much minority populations are underrepresented. So important to really understand where patients are coming from when they enter a healthcare institution.

Dr. Nicole Rochester: 

Absolutely. Thank you. Thank you so much for that. Dr. Gamble, can you speak to awareness? You spoke about the fact that sometimes patients are referred to perhaps the wrong provider. You know, there was that sent, you mentioned to a general surgeon instead of to a gynecologic oncologist. And so we can imagine that there may be some challenges both in the primary care setting and perhaps even among general obstetrician gynecologists. So can you speak to how we can elevate the level of awareness to enhance healthcare provider awareness of diagnosis and access disparities and really appropriate referral patterns?

Dr. Charlotte Gamble:

Yeah, absolutely. I think it’s a tough question. I think it’s, again, like all things, it’s a little bit nuanced. Sometimes, again different levels of providers, different parts of the country, everybody practices a little bit differently. So everyone knows once you get a cancer diagnosis, you should probably go to a cancer specialist. And so generally, that’s coming to a gynecologic oncologist generally, or that’s sometimes that’s going to a medical oncologist. But occasionally, sometimes patients will have symptoms where it’s just abnormal bleeding, and they’re seeing a general gynecologist who then does a hysterectomy, and there’s a surprise diagnosis of an endometrial cancer.

Usually they’re, hopefully, they’re not making it too much to kind of the general surgery pathway our general surgery colleagues are awesome, but it’s kind of a different kettle of fish and the type of hysterectomy that’s needed and the type of specific surgery that’s needed to include lymph node assessment is different for somebody who’s getting a cancer surgery for uterine cancer compared to, let’s say, for fibroids or for adenomyosis or a non-gynecologic cancer situation.

I think, again, I’m on the receiving end of all of this, so I see patients who have made it to my doorstep and gotten kind of through the hoops and the barriers, but there’s definitely those out there that we know from the data somehow ended up with their surgery, not exactly in the appropriate hands.

And it’s hard to say, I don’t know if I actually even have advice for like how this is supposed to happen. I think we need to understand kind of the as Dr. Gogoi alluded to earlier, just kind of how prevalent endometrial cancer is right now and how the rates are rising and that abnormal bleeding has to be taken very seriously. And the thing that I harp on the most is a normal ultrasound does not mean there’s nothing else to explore there. There has to be a tissue biopsy.

And really impressing that on both patients as well as the first kind of people that they see, either their primary care doctor or even a nurse practitioner, a physician assistant. Just because there’s a normal ultrasound does not mean that your work is done. And we have studies to really demonstrate how that can delay patient’s care and missed diagnoses can happen. So it’s hard to answer your question, to like, how do we fix the referral pathway system? I don’t know the answer to that, and maybe Dr. Gogoi can speak to that, but I will say from like a screening standpoint, since there’s no great screening test, an ultrasound is not, might be the first step, but it’s definitely not the only step and it cannot be the last.

Dr. Nicole Rochester:

I appreciate that. As you were talking, I was thinking like this needs to be a major awareness campaign, not just for healthcare providers, but for patients as well. You know, this idea that abnormal or or postmenopausal bleeding is never normal and make sure your doctor gets a tissue biopsy and not just an ultrasound. Dr. Gogoi, we’ve talked already about some of the obstacles and barriers faced by patients. Can you talk about some of the obstacles or barriers that are faced by healthcare providers when treating endometrial cancer?

Dr. Radhika Gogoi:

Yeah, I think that the one other barrier that sort of comes up a lot specifically in terms of maybe even in terms of getting a patient to their referring providers or a G1 oncologist is transportation. I find that transportation is a huge issue for our patients. And it’s mostly associated with cost. So I think that one of the things that really, that we can do as a community is to somehow provide means or ways for our patients to get to us once they’re diagnosed. It’s hard enough to get them to us but when they’re facing challenges of cost and transportation, that becomes even more challenging.

So I think that that’s from a patient standpoint. And then, and then I think what Dr. Gamble mentioned about really the barriers for providers is really education around ultrasound and how those how specifically perhaps even in Black women, that it’s not as predictive of endometrial cancer risk and that an ultrasound alone is not enough of a workup for a number of these patients to rule out some underlying pathology. So that’s huge, and again mistrust of the medical profession is something that all healthcare providers deal with. And allowing time for patients to ask their questions, to be transparent about what it is that you’re doing and why I think goes a long way towards overcoming those challenges.

Dr. Nicole Rochester:

Thank you both for that. I think we’ve gotten a lot of information around the causes of the disparities and some actions that we can begin taking. Are there any unforeseen or outdated practice-related barriers that may hinder your work and that of your colleagues? And on that same note, are there any solutions or actions related to those? And I’ll start with you on this one, Dr. Gamble.

Dr. Charlotte Gamble:

Well, starting all the way back, I think an outdated practice is not listening to patients, and not recognizing your own privilege as a provider. I think that to Dr. Gogoi’s point that she’s mentioned a couple of times now, I have innumerable patients that just felt that they were not listened to felt that they couldn’t…that their stories were not being heard, that they faced no’s, no’s, no’s at multiple levels in trying to seek care for abnormal bleeding, and come to me very frustrated and kind of weary. And I think just really understanding how vulnerable patients are when they’re seeking care, and being cognizant of the privilege that we have as healthcare providers is something that is more contemporary compared to an outdated practice of being very paternalistic.

I guess sometimes I have had patients who are like, yeah, I was told that I needed a biopsy and I just…the way that they told me and the way that they said that it had to be done tomorrow, it freaked me out, and I couldn’t do it. And it’s just kind of unfortunate when the recommendations might be correct, but the way in which it’s being delivered is not being received by the patients in a way that they’re able to be receptive to.

I think another outdated practice again that I harp on that I’m such a strong believer in is like just the role of the ultrasound. I really, I don’t like it. I hate it. I think it’s useful for knowing uterine size and maybe if there’s some kind of stuff inside the uterus, but abnormal bleeding either before menopause or after menopause has to have a tissued biopsy. So I think that’s outdated to just get an ultrasound and have the patient come back, because it continues to perpetuate delays in care, and I think disparities to an extent. Another outdated…no, I don’t know. Is there anything else, Dr. Gogoi, that you’d add to this?

Dr. Radhika Gogoi:

I feel like this is a lot lot older now. It used to be at one point that we used to do all our endometrial cancer patients with open surgery. I think that now, I guess it’s even more outdated than outdated. Most of the surgeries are now pretty much done either minimally, invasively laparoscopically or robotically. There are obviously extenuating circumstances to both of those things, but I think approach to surgery is also sort of evolved.

The treatment paradigm for patients with advanced endometrial cancers has evolved even more so in the last maybe two years or so with the role of immunotherapy. So encouraging our patients to be educated about their options, both for route of surgery, for treatment and to make sure to ask those questions at the time of their office visit I think is something that we should all encourage.

Dr. Charlotte Gamble:

I would dovetail from that and also say, to kind of harken back to some of the other things we discussed in terms of referral pathways and things like that, and just how gynecologic oncology care is delivered in different parts of the country, there are various models for this, and so classically, patients who have gynecologic cancers, including endometrial cancer are managed solely by the gynecologic oncologist, meaning a surgical subspecialist like myself or Dr. Gogoi, who not only do the surgery, but also deliver if patients need it chemotherapy or specialized systemic therapies afterwards, sometimes with a component in partnership with a radiation oncologist.

But there are parts of the country by institution or by geography where the care that comes after the initial surgery done by the gynecologic oncologist might be shared with a medical oncologist who may or may not actually have super sub-specialized training when it comes to gynecologic cancers, because again, historically, this has been an area that’s been managed really by our subspecialty.

And so I encourage patients as well as referring doctors, et cetera, et cetera, to make sure that whoever, if there’s additional therapies that are needed after the hysterectomy is done, such as chemotherapy or immunotherapy, as Dr. Gogoi alluded to, that that is done in partnership with a gynecologic oncologist, because our field is kind of driving where so much of the contemporary understanding of how to manage these conditions long-term is coming from. And to make sure that if a medical oncologist is doing this, they feel very competent. They do this all the time, and they’re working in close partnership with their gynecologic oncology colleagues.

Dr. Nicole Rochester:

Wonderful. Thank you for that. So as we talk about outdated practices, I guess the other side of the coin is innovation and continuous improvement. And so I’ll turn this question to you, Dr. Gogoi. How can healthcare providers and hospital leaders foster a culture of innovation and continuous improvement? So that’s some of these outdated practices that you all, that you and Dr. Gamble, discussed are really no longer a thing?

Dr. Radhika Gogoi:

Yeah. So I couldn’t agree more.I think that some of those innovative approaches really come from enrolling in clinical trials. And so I think that the importance of having minority populations, equally represented in clinical trials is essential. Otherwise we’re not going to make the progress that we need to make to really equal the playing field here, so to speak. So I think that that really is a huge player trying to educate patients about clinical trial options, being transparent about what those look like, who benefits, what the data suggests, why it’s important to me is again, really key.

Dr. Nicole Rochester:

Wonderful. And Dr. Gamble, if we were to be specific, are there any healthcare provider to healthcare provider strategies, anything that you’ve seen work, maybe things that you’ve done yourself, innovative approaches or protocols with regard to this idea of innovation and continuous improvement?

Dr. Charlotte Gamble:

Yeah, I think different institutions have different cultures, and I think having institutional culture that embraces change that is, desires to be on the vanguard of advancing science, and the science could be in terms of bench research. It could be in terms of clinical trials, it could be in terms of healthcare delivery, really trying to advance and push forward. The science and how we get the best care to our patients in the most timely fashion I think is really important. Culture is hard to change, and we all work in institutions that have various different cultures. I think that healthcare provider to healthcare provider, I think open lines of communication are great. I tell folks, text, call, email, whatever you need to do to get patients in a timely fashion is necessary.

I think the understanding of we are one person working within a team is really necessary. So patients might say, oh, Dr. Gamble this, Dr. Gamble that, but I always, always, always tell them that I cannot do this work without my nurse navigator, without my fellow, without my residents, without my inpatient floor nurses, the oncology nurses, and really understanding that oncology care specifically is a really big team sport.

And healthcare leaders, when we’re thinking about things from a system level, I think sometimes have different like just help making sure that everybody understands how much of a team sport that this is. How much the radiation oncologists, the medical oncologists interface with us on a regular basis, I think is really important. And to understand that we’re all in this together to deliver the best care to our patients. I really think the role of health, like nurse navigators and lay navigators needs to be further pushed forward within our field, including not only gynecologic oncology, but just gynecology in general, and that’s some of the work that I’m doing from a research standpoint now. And so I’d love to see the role of navigators be fully embraced and somehow reimbursed by healthcare systems in general.

Dr. Nicole Rochester:

Absolutely. Well, it is time to wrap up this roundtable. I have really enjoyed talking with both of you as always. I have learned a lot. I’m sure that our audience will learn a lot from this conversation. And before we go, I’d love to get closing thoughts. So I’m going to start with you, Dr. Gogoi. What is one takeaway message that you would like to leave with the healthcare professionals who will watch this program?

Dr. Radhika Gogoi:

So I guess the one takeaway would be that, as I think about my role in sort of disparities prevention, if you say it is really as an educator, and so the importance of community education on symptoms, on diagnosis, on treatment approaches, I think it’s essential that we don’t think of ourselves as a silo. I’m not just, but I’m part of the larger community as Dr. Gamble spoke about. And to be part of that larger community means that I need to be within that community and function within the community. So whether it’s me, community navigators, health educators to really play a role in educating our patients about how to approach their symptoms.

Dr. Nicole Rochester: 

Wonderful. Thank you, Dr. Gogoi. And what about you, Dr. Gamble, what’s your closing thought that you would like to leave with the audience?

Dr. Charlotte Gamble: 

Yeah, I think for healthcare providers in general, I think the thing that I think is most important is, again, being able to listen to patients, working and encouraging the systems that we are housed into, be able to be responsive to them, so that if patients are educated, do know that there’s something wrong. They’re able to not only get a hold of someone, but also be listened to and heard and taken seriously. And we have a lot to do in that regard. So I think just understanding again, our role and how privileged we are to be in our jobs, in this line of work, and being able to leverage that to listen to patients and get them the timely care that they need.

Dr. Nicole Rochester:

Wonderful. Well, thank you both again, Dr. Gogoi, Dr. Gamble, thank you for this enlightening conversation. We’ve learned so much about endometrial cancer. I think for me, the main takeaway is postmenopausal bleeding, abnormal irregular bleeding is never normal. It needs to be evaluated. You both spoke about the importance of biopsy and not just an ultrasound, and in fact that ultrasound can be normal.

And with regard to disparities, I really appreciate both of your thoughts around community education, and this being a team sport and listening to our patients. So again, thank you so much for being here today, and thank you all for watching the program and tuning into this Empowering Providers to Empower Patients, Patient Empowerment Network program. I’m Dr. Nicole Rochester. Thanks again for watching.

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PODCAST: What Do You Need to Know About Emerging Endometrial Cancer Research?

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Endometrial cancer treatment and research is evolving quickly. Dr. Emily Ko provides an update on new and emerging approaches, explains how these therapies work to treat endometrial cancer, and shares tips for partnering with your team on key decisions.
 
Dr. Emily Ko is a gynecologic oncologist and Associate Professor of Obstetrics and Gynecology at the University of Pennsylvania. Learn more about Dr. Ko.

See More from Evolve Endometrial Cancer

Transcript:

Katherine:

Hello, and welcome. I’m your host, Katherine Banwell. Today’s program focuses on helping patients with endometrial cancer learn more about evolving research and treatments. We’re also going to discuss how patients can collaborate with their team on care decisions. Before we meet our guest, let’s review a few important details. The reminder email you received about this program contains a link to program materials. If you haven’t already, click that link to access information to follow along during the webinar. 

At the end of the program, you’ll receive a link to a program survey. Please take a moment to provide feedback about your experience today in order to help us plan future webinars. And finally, before we get into the discussion, please remember that this program is not a substitute for seeking medical advice. Please refer to your healthcare team about what might be best for you. Well, let’s meet our guest today. Joining us is Dr. Emily Ko. Dr. Ko, welcome. Would you please introduce yourself? 

Dr. Ko:

Surely. Thank you so much. My name is Dr. Emily Ko, and I am a gynecologic oncologist. Currently, I’m an associate professor at the University of Pennsylvania, and as part of my daily work, I see patients, I provide surgical and medical treatments for gynecologic cancers, and I also am a researcher involved particularly in endometrial cancer. 

Katherine:

Thank you so much for taking the time out of your schedule to join us today. 

Dr. Ko:

Thank you. 

Katherine:

Well, let’s start by learning about the latest research news. Just this June, endometrial cancer researchers from around the world met to discuss their findings at the annual American Society of Clinical Oncology meeting, or ASCO, in Chicago. Can you walk us through the highlights that patients should know about? 

Dr. Ko:

Sure. So, the ASCO meeting is a very big meeting that happens once a year in June, and really, it is a national – actually, international – meeting where the biggest breakthroughs in cancer therapy are really presented and discussed. 

So, within the field of gynecologic cancer and specifically endometrial cancer, we really saw a couple breakthrough clinical trial results, if you will. The two specific trials that have hit the spotlight – and, it was presented at ASCO; they were also previously presented at the Society of Gynecologic Oncology annual meeting in March of 2023. These two trials – one of them is called GY018, and the other one is called RUBY, and these two trials specifically were geared at patients with endometrial cancer of either advanced stage, meaning stage III or IV at diagnosis, or patients who have recurrent endometrial cancer.  

And, these both trials were very large, multisite, international trials enrolling a huge number of patients. They were randomized controlled trials, meaning that they were specifically testing what we call a standard therapy, Taxol-carboplatin, versus a standard therapy plus a newer agent, and that newer agent falls in the realm of an immunotherapy drug. 

So, with this kind of novel approach, where we’re combining standardly used chemotherapy plus a newer immunotherapy drug, the question was if you did this combination, would patients have a better outcome? And, in fact, the groundbreaking news was that yes, patients did have a better outcome with this new combination of therapy, and this was shown in various forms of results. 

One of the primary outcomes is always something called survival, and with the GY018, they looked at progression-free survival as a primary outcome, and it did show that patients on this new combination did better with progression-free survival. And the difference was about median of about three months. Now, that may not sound like a whole lot. However, in the realm of cancer therapy, when you take a very large group of patients, that was a meaningful difference that was statistically significant. 

And furthermore, as we’re moving forward with our therapy drugs, we are moving into this era of targeted therapy, precision medicine, where we’re really trying to hone into more the specifics of the biology of each person’s cancer, and not treating everyone the same. 

What’s interesting with these two trials is when they looked at different subpopulations of patients with advanced or recurrent endometrial cancer, whether they had a type of endometrial cancer that was considered MSI-high, or a microsatellite instable type of cancer, which basically refers to a certain biology of these endometrial cancers, it has to deal with how the cells – the cancer cells – behave, how they’re able to not follow the rules and be able to replicate themselves. 

The patients who are MSI-high particularly had a really great response with this chemotherapy, so it was even beyond just a three-month difference. With that being said, even in patients who are what we call microsatellite-stable, who didn’t have this unique signature, they still saw a benefit with this novel combination, and to add to that, the nice thing about it is the toxicities were not bad. Even this new combination was very well-tolerated. 

It was not a high rate of severe toxicities or side effects, if you will, and that actually, the great majority of patients were able to stay on this therapy and really get through – complete the therapy course. 

So, there are some sort of nuanced differences between the two trials I mentioned, GY018 versus the RUBY. And some of those details are with regards to the even specific subtype of endometrial cancer, which we haven’t talked about yet, for example, uterine carcinosarcoma versus uterine serous carcinoma, uterine clear cell, uterine endometrioid – these are all specific subtypes of endometrial cancer. So there are some nuances where the RUBY trial was able to include patients with uterine carcinosarcoma, whereas the GY018 did not. 

But suffice it to say, now we have enough data that virtually all endometrial cancer patients with advanced stage, regardless of what histology, there is essentially a trial that can apply to you where it demonstrated this added benefit to doing this novel combination, and that was found with microsatellite-stable patients as well as microsatellite-instable in both randomized controlled trials that I mentioned. 

Katherine:

Such exciting news! That’s great! Well, beyond ASCO, Dr. Ko, are there other research or treatment advances that patients should know about?  

Dr. Ko:

Certainly. Like I mentioned, we’re really moving towards the realm of treating with a targeted therapy approach, and within endometrial cancer, the prior paradigm was much simpler, but really not in the space of target therapy. So, for example, what does that mean? 

So, as we’re realizing that there are very unique biologic signatures to different patients’ endometrial cancer – there could be, for example, some cancers that are particularly receptive to hormonal therapy, meaning their specific cancer, when we send it for detailed – we call it genomic or somatic testing, we can discover, oh, they have estrogen-receptor-positive, progesterone-receptor-positive, and so, those type of cancers may be very responsive to hormonal-based therapy, and in that space, we have a standard available drugs, but we also have clinical trials that are trying newer drugs. 

If, for example, the standard aromatase inhibitor or the standard progesterone agent may be helpful, but there are even more in that space that this point – CDK inhibitors that you can combine with these aromatase inhibitors or hormonal agents that have been around for longer that have shown a lot of promise, a lot of data in breast cancer. But now we’re realizing, wow, there could be some efficacy in endometrial cancer as well, so that’s just one example. 

And there’s other unique biologic gene signatures, again, kind of a good list now out there, that are being studied in various clinical trials, whether they’re PARP inhibitors, whether they’re drugs that target CCNE1, whether they’re drugs that target ARID1A, so there are actually many more that are available. So, they’re really expanding the opportunity for treatment for endometrial cancer patients. 

Katherine:

Well, you just mentioned clinical trials, and I think it’s a good topic to cover a little bit. Why is it important for patients to actually consider enrolling? What are the benefits for them? 

Dr. Ko:

Sure.

So, while we certainly have a good armamentarium of standard-of-care therapies already, and I should mention that does include our classic chemotherapy drugs like paclitaxel (Abraxane), carboplatin (Paraplatin), and even doxorubicin (Adriamycin), if you will, or doxorubicin Hcl (Doxil), there are the immunotherapy drugs now that have become standard of care as well, like pembrolizumab (Keytruda), but sometimes, despite using those best available drugs, the cancer unfortunately either continues to grow or you had a good response, but somehow it shows up again – the cancer shows up again – and so, then, we’re looking for additional opportunities, additional therapies. 

And so, some of the best opportunities are actually to consider these clinical trials. The way that clinical trials are designed is that they always are going  to provide you at least a backbone of a standard available therapy, so you’re never going to get less than what would be considered standard of care. 

But, what they’re doing is they’re usually partnering another drug – a more novel therapy – or they’re basically testing a more novel therapy that could be more targeted, that could potentially have better efficacy than what’s already available standardly. And so, the value of that is that you could have an opportunity to have a therapy that could work even better.  

When you’ve tried something already, unfortunately, the cancer has grown, there is still opportunity, and while you’re on a clinical trial, I think one of the huge benefits is it’s very regulated. You are monitored so closely because at the base of all of this is safety. There is never going to be a drug or therapy that’s going to be administered to a patient without ensuring that there’s absolute safety for that patient, and so, that’s a way that you really have opportunity to get more treatment that could really help your cancer condition and do it in a very, very safe, formal fashion. 

Katherine:

And ultimately help others as well, in the future.  

Dr. Ko:

Exactly, absolutely, because as you’re participating in this process – and, of course, it’s a voluntary process to participate on a clinical trial, so we so appreciate all the patients who, in the past, have participated and are willing to participate in the future, but allows us also to really gather a lot of information to really inform cancer treatment for all the patients coming down the road, and those could be anyone. They could be our neighbors, our friends, our own family members, and that could really be so helpful to everyone that’s going through this type of thing. 

Katherine:

Absolutely, yeah. I’d like to back up a bit and talk about what endometrial cancer is. It’s often referred to as uterine cancer. So, are they the same thing? Are these terms interchangeable? 

Dr. Ko:

Sure, it’s a great question. So, endometrial cancer refers to cancer that starts in what I call the lining of the uterine cavity. So, inside the uterus, there’s a uterine cavity, and there’s a tissue that coats that cavity, and that’s called the endometrium. So, endometrial cancer is basically when cancer cells start growing from that tissue. And, of course, since that exists in the uterus, of course, it’s considered uterine cancer, and we’re just being a little bit more specific when we say endometrial cancer. But, of course, endometrial cancer is the most common form of uterine cancer by far, so in some ways, it’s almost – it’s synonymous.  

Katherine:

How is endometrial cancer staged? 

Dr. Ko:

So, the most classic, rigorous way to stage endometrial cancer is through a surgical procedure. So, what that usually involves is it does include a hysterectomy, removing the uterus and the cervix, usually also includes removing the fallopian tubes and the ovaries. 

And, at the same time, the surgeon will do a very thorough assessment of the abdominal pelvic cavity, basically looking around all those areas to see if there’s any signs of visible disease, anything they can see that looks like it could be tumor deposits in the abdominal cavity. If anything is seen, those deposits will be removed and biopsied, so that’s part of the staging procedure. 

And additionally, it’s important to try to assess the lymph nodes, typically. So, there are lymph nodes in the pelvic area, and then, higher up along the aortic area, and so, there are different surgical techniques that we can use to basically test or sample some of those lymph nodes, be able to remove them, send them to the pathologist, look under the microscope to see if there are any microscopic cancer cells that have traveled to those lymph nodes. 

So, that is all part of a surgical procedure, and with all the information collected from those tissue samples that are removed from the body and sent to the pathologist, but the pathologist then reviews all of that under a microscope, and then can issue a very thorough report describing where the cancer cells are located, and by definition, where the cancer cells are located then defines what the stage is of the cancer. 

Katherine:

Can you give me an example? 

Dr. Ko:

Of course. So, for example, if the cancer cells are located only in the uterus, and they’re not found anywhere else, then that is a stage I. If the cancer cells have traveled to the cervix area specifically, this we call a cervical stroma, that becomes a stage II. If the cancer cells have, for example, traveled to the fallopian tubes, or the ovaries, or the lymph nodes, then that becomes a stage III, and there are sort of substages within those categories as well. 

Katherine:

But stage III would be the highest or most severe? 

Dr. Ko:

So, there’s stage III, and then there’s actually stage IV. So, if the cancer cells have traveled outside of the pelvis into the abdominal area, then we consider that a stage IV. 

Katherine:

And that would be considered advanced endometrial cancer? 

Dr. Ko:

Right. So, by definition, “advanced” typically refers to stage III or IV. 

Katherine:

I see, okay. Now that we understand more about the disease itself, I’d like to talk about the treatments that are currently available. You mentioned chemotherapy, but what else is available for people? 

Dr. Ko:

Absolutely. So, treatment for endometrial cancer is usually some combination of surgery, and then it may be followed by possibly chemotherapy, as well as radiation, and sometimes, it may be a combination of all three treatments, or sometimes, it’s a combination of one or two of those, depending on the exact stage, depending on the exact cell type, and some of the other factors. 

Katherine:

Are hormonal therapies used as well, and targeted therapies? 

Dr. Ko:

Yes. 

Katherine:

I know they are in other cancers. 

Dr. Ko:

Yes. And so, I think the question is where do those come into play? So, I would say the usual algorithm most commonly would be that surgery is done first, as the most common first step, and then, based on the information obtained from surgery and the pathology report that comes from that, then there’s usually some type of a recommendation about should there be a second stepped treatment, and that frequently can be chemotherapy/radiation.  

Now, the areas where targeted therapy – for example, immunotherapy – where does that come in? So, that now has come into the – I would call it the second stage. We’re combining it with the classic chemotherapy drugs – Taxol-carboplatin, for example. That’s one example where it could come into play. Another example could come into play where a patient had gone through classic Taxol/paclitaxel and carboplatin, then had cancer come back, and so, that could be another instance where that pembrolizumab or pembro with lenvatinib (Lenvima) combination can be used in the setting of recurrence. 

Now, we could also say, hey, if your cancer type has those hormonal receptors present or is some type of what we call endometrioid histology, and we think that hormonal therapy may be more effective in that case, then that could also be used in a setting where the cancer has kind of grown again, the cancer has grown back, or actually, there are certain situations where patients, for example, may not undergo a hysterectomy. 

And, there are unique cases and those situations where patients are still trying to preserve their fertility, and therefore not wanting to undergo a hysterectomy, or they’re unable to undergo surgery safely. And so, in some unique situations, we may also use hormonal therapy as the mechanism to treat their cancer, and whether that is by way of a pill, whether that is by way of a progesterone intrauterine device, IUD, that is placed into the uterus, we also have situations where we tailor the therapy to the condition of the patient. 

Katherine:

How are patients monitored for a recurrence, and are there approaches to help prevent a recurrence? 

Dr. Ko:

Sure, absolutely. Great question. It is important to continue monitoring patients, even after they’ve gone through treatment. So, I think of it as a multifaceted approach. Usually, it includes office visits, including a physical exam. It includes a thorough intake of all of their symptoms. 

It also includes – depending on the scenario – in some circumstances, regular imaging studies, such as a CT scan or MRI, and sometimes, we also do things like PET scans, and I think that does have to be tailored to the unique patient’s endometrial cancer, unique case, stage, histology, and we kind of tailor which tests we choose to do. The interval of monitoring can vary, so I would say generally speaking, it could be anywhere from three- to six-month visits, and with potentially added scans, as we talked about, and sometimes, we also do certain blood tests in certain cases where we may choose to follow a CA125 blood tumor marker. 

But, I would say that there are different, definitely variants to how we choose to monitor, and there are certain resources we tend to use, such as the NCCN guidelines that providers may reference, and sometimes may even share with the patients to explain why and how we choose to do the monitoring. 

Katherine:

When treating more advanced endometrial cancer disease in general, are the treatment options different than if you were treating somebody who had stage I or stage II, for instance? 

Dr. Ko:

Sure, great question. So, for some patients with, say, stage I, surgery alone is enough. 

For some other patients, subcategories of stage I, where we call them more high/intermediate-risk patients, they’re stage I, but there are a few features about their pathology that might make them slightly higher risk for recurrence – in those cases, we might consider a little bit of radiation after surgery, what we call adjuvant radiation or what we call radiation vaginal brachytherapy. Just three short treatments of a little bit of radiation to the top of the vagina has been shown to possibly decrease chance of recurrence in that area with very minimal side effects. 

So, that would be more commonly in line with stage I. There are some subtypes that can still be what we call high-risk, even in stage I/stage II uterine serous carcinoma, uterine carcinosarcoma. In those cases, we might also recommend chemotherapy along with some vaginal brachytherapy following their hysterectomy, so that’s the early stage. 

And then, with the advanced stage, yes. So, frequently, it’d be surgery first to secure the diagnosis, followed by some type of – it might be primarily chemotherapy, or it could be combination chemotherapy with radiation. And over time, I would say our paradigm for what we use for chemotherapy and radiation has changed a little bit. 

If you go back a couple decades, I think radiation was used a lot – whole pelvic radiation, even just without any chemotherapy. And then, we then had more data from research clinical trials, GOG-258 or PORTEC-3, that then had given us evidence that perhaps doing chemotherapy with some combination of radiation is going to be beneficial, or even moving towards primarily radiation could be a very good option in terms of long-term benefit/long-term survival. 

And, of course, that brings us to the present day, those two trials that I mentioned from ASCO, the GY018 and the RUBY, now bringing in the immunotherapy component to the chemotherapy, so there has definitely been an evolution to managing advanced stage. 

Katherine:

Yes. Dr. Ko, what goes into determining a treatment approach for an individual patient? Is there key testing that helps guide a patient’s prognosis and treatment options? 

Dr. Ko:

Absolutely. So, I think the key pieces of information come from several sources. First, we do take the whole patient into account, like baseline health, baseline function, meaning every day, how active are you? Are there limitations to your daily activities? Looking at baseline health conditions, what we call comorbidities. Are there other health conditions, like diabetes, heart conditions, lung condition, kidney conditions, that could really impact a patient’s overall health and wellbeing? That is always part of it, number one. 

Then, we look specific to the cancer details. So, from all the pathology information, biopsies, followed by a surgical staging procedure, what exact stage, what exact substage, and we might even look at other unique features. Was there cells that got into the lymph vessels, the lymph nodes? Are there other just features from a pathology standpoint that are important, like the – I talked about microsatellite status, microsatellite instable versus microsatellite stable. 

Those are all information we can gather from the tumor tissue itself. That then kind of tailors our therapy. And then, like I was saying, now we’re going into this molecular era where we can actually take that tumor tissue and even do more expanded testing on it. 

So, I think it’s worthwhile to talk to your provider and say, “Hey, would it be worthwhile to send my tumor out for expanded testing, whether it’s done at your institution, at a specialized lab, or whether it’s sent out to a company that does expanded testing?” Because then, they might be able to test for 500 different genetic signatures, a much more broad panel, but that might open the door for opportunities to say, “Hey, you actually do have a very unique signature, and maybe it is worth tailoring your therapy even further.” 

So, I think these are very important questions to have with your provider, and these pieces of information can help guide the prognosis. I think we’re always asking what does this mean long-term, and I think when we have all these individual pieces of information, we can then give guidance on that.  

Katherine:

Well, that leads me into my next question. I wanted to get your point of view on why is it important for patients to engage in their care and their treatment decisions? 

Dr. Ko:

Right. I think that it is so important. Medical treatments, I think, do work the best for the patient when the patient is truly an active participant, and what I mean by that is I think we can really understand the patient if there’s a conversation, there’s a mutual discussion, and I think every patient has unique circumstances, has unique goals, has…whether it’s just the daily whatever responsibilities, or just either health or non-health concerns that they have, we want to be able to find a treatment that fits the patient, and we realize that one treatment doesn’t fit all. 

And so, the more, I think, that there is this mutual discussion, mutual understanding, then there’s a mutual decision treatment plan that is made, and there’s the more ability to modify that plan when – if you realize, oh, maybe we can tailor it, maybe we try one thing, and maybe we realize we got to change a little bit.  

And, I think that with a cancer condition, it is a journey. It is not just a one-time thing. It really is a journey, and I think that the more a patient can participate throughout that journey, I think the better the outcomes for the patient, and honestly, the better the treatment course will be for everyone participating. 

Katherine:

Why should a patient consider finding an endometrial cancer specialist? What are the benefits? 

Dr. Ko:

So, I think naturally, an endometrial cancer specialist is a provider who spends more time thinking about the disease, reading about it, looking at what’s the newest research studies that are coming out, what are the available clinical trials here, locally, regionally, or nationally, what are other support services available for the patient in the space. 

And, of course, probably the folks that do the most surgeries gear towards endometrial cancer patients, and so, I think just working in that space naturally then brings more resources and more opportunity for the patient to kind of really know what’s out there, what is the newest, and I think that really benefits the patient. 

Katherine:

Thank you for sharing all this information. I’d like to close with your thoughts on the future of endometrial cancer care. Are you hopeful? 

Dr. Ko:

Yes. I think that I’m especially hopeful, especially within these last even few years, of where our field is going. I want to say I think there’s so much more that needs to be done.  

I don’t think we’re ready to close the books on endometrial cancer. I think this is just a wonderful opening of a chapter where we’re seeing many more therapies come about. I do think that something that is concerning is that we are seeing more cases of endometrial cancer being diagnosed – yeah, so it is absolutely true. There is very robust data that is collected by our CDC and cancer registry in the country, and it is showing that there is actually a rising incidence, that the number of endometrial cancer cases in this country is actually increasing over time, and it has – 

Katherine:

Why is that? 

Dr. Ko:

It’s a great question. 

Katherine:

Nobody knows – the data doesn’t include that information? 

Dr. Ko:

I think there’s definitely some information, there is definitely information out there. I think some of it – and this is not all of it – I think some of it is related to the increase in obesity and the increase in average weight over time, and this metabolic condition to some degree, I think, does stimulate potential risk for endometrial cancer. 

However, that is not the only reason, and what is concerning is that what we’re seeing is there’s a specific rise in subtypes of endometrial cancer in certain populations, particularly the Black and Hispanic patient populations, and we’re seeing a rise in the most aggressive types of endometrial cancer in those patient populations. I think there’s a lot of research going on right now in that to try to understand why. Is it just because we’re picking it up more? I don’t think that’s the bottom line. 

And, I think what we’re also realizing as we’re studying these various tumor types of endometrial cancer, they are driven by different biology. So, I think to some extent, the ones that are more maybe related to obesity or hormones and all may be slightly different – not completely separate, but that there is underlying different genetic basis for some of these cancers developing, and whether that’s a combination of underlying genes, environment, exposure, or all of the numerous factors, we just know it is happening, and so, it really is critical in my mind that the awareness and the focus and attention on endometrial cancers is really there, that we really think about it, that we share the information as much as possible, and that we can really then come to better – have more opportunity for treatments, be able to diagnose it sooner, be able to have more opportunities to treat it, and honestly, have better survival and outcomes for our patients. 

Katherine:

Dr. Ko, thank you so much for joining us today. You’ve given us so much information. 

Dr. Ko:

Thank you. It was my pleasure. 

Katherine:

And thank you to all of our collaborators. If you would like to watch this webinar again, there will be a replay available soon. You’ll receive an email when it’s ready. And don’t forget to take the survey immediately following this webinar. It will help us as we plan future programs. To learn more about endometrial cancer and to access tools to help you become a proactive patient, visit PowerfulPatients.org. I’m Katherine Banwell. Thanks for joining us. 

What Do You Need to Know About Emerging Endometrial Cancer Research?

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What Do You Need to Know About Emerging Endometrial Cancer Research? from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

Endometrial cancer treatment and research is evolving quickly. Dr. Emily Ko provides an update on new and emerging approaches, explains how these therapies work to treat endometrial cancer, and shares tips for partnering with your team on key decisions.
 
Dr. Emily Ko is a gynecologic oncologist and Associate Professor of Obstetrics and Gynecology at the University of Pennsylvania. Learn more about Dr. Ko.
See More from Evolve Endometrial Cancer

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Endometrial Cancer Treatment Options for Patients to Consider

 Emerging Endometrial Cancer Treatments _ Promising Data and Challenges

Emerging Endometrial Cancer Treatments | Promising Data and Challenges

Transcript:

Katherine:

Hello, and welcome. I’m your host, Katherine Banwell. Today’s program focuses on helping patients with endometrial cancer learn more about evolving research and treatments. We’re also going to discuss how patients can collaborate with their team on care decisions. Before we meet our guest, let’s review a few important details. The reminder email you received about this program contains a link to program materials. If you haven’t already, click that link to access information to follow along during the webinar. 

At the end of the program, you’ll receive a link to a program survey. Please take a moment to provide feedback about your experience today in order to help us plan future webinars. And finally, before we get into the discussion, please remember that this program is not a substitute for seeking medical advice. Please refer to your healthcare team about what might be best for you. Well, let’s meet our guest today. Joining us is Dr. Emily Ko. Dr. Ko, welcome. Would you please introduce yourself? 

Dr. Ko:

Surely. Thank you so much. My name is Dr. Emily Ko, and I am a gynecologic oncologist. Currently, I’m an associate professor at the University of Pennsylvania, and as part of my daily work, I see patients, I provide surgical and medical treatments for gynecologic cancers, and I also am a researcher involved particularly in endometrial cancer. 

Katherine:

Thank you so much for taking the time out of your schedule to join us today. 

Dr. Ko:

Thank you. 

Katherine:

Well, let’s start by learning about the latest research news. Just this June, endometrial cancer researchers from around the world met to discuss their findings at the annual American Society of Clinical Oncology meeting, or ASCO, in Chicago. Can you walk us through the highlights that patients should know about? 

Dr. Ko:

Sure. So, the ASCO meeting is a very big meeting that happens once a year in June, and really, it is a national – actually, international – meeting where the biggest breakthroughs in cancer therapy are really presented and discussed. 

So, within the field of gynecologic cancer and specifically endometrial cancer, we really saw a couple breakthrough clinical trial results, if you will. The two specific trials that have hit the spotlight – and, it was presented at ASCO; they were also previously presented at the Society of Gynecologic Oncology annual meeting in March of 2023. These two trials – one of them is called GY018, and the other one is called RUBY, and these two trials specifically were geared at patients with endometrial cancer of either advanced stage, meaning stage III or IV at diagnosis, or patients who have recurrent endometrial cancer.  

And, these both trials were very large, multisite, international trials enrolling a huge number of patients. They were randomized controlled trials, meaning that they were specifically testing what we call a standard therapy, Taxol-carboplatin, versus a standard therapy plus a newer agent, and that newer agent falls in the realm of an immunotherapy drug. 

So, with this kind of novel approach, where we’re combining standardly used chemotherapy plus a newer immunotherapy drug, the question was if you did this combination, would patients have a better outcome? And, in fact, the groundbreaking news was that yes, patients did have a better outcome with this new combination of therapy, and this was shown in various forms of results. 

One of the primary outcomes is always something called survival, and with the GY018, they looked at progression-free survival as a primary outcome, and it did show that patients on this new combination did better with progression-free survival. And the difference was about median of about three months. Now, that may not sound like a whole lot. However, in the realm of cancer therapy, when you take a very large group of patients, that was a meaningful difference that was statistically significant. 

And furthermore, as we’re moving forward with our therapy drugs, we are moving into this era of targeted therapy, precision medicine, where we’re really trying to hone into more the specifics of the biology of each person’s cancer, and not treating everyone the same. 

What’s interesting with these two trials is when they looked at different subpopulations of patients with advanced or recurrent endometrial cancer, whether they had a type of endometrial cancer that was considered MSI-high, or a microsatellite instable type of cancer, which basically refers to a certain biology of these endometrial cancers, it has to deal with how the cells – the cancer cells – behave, how they’re able to not follow the rules and be able to replicate themselves. 

The patients who are MSI-high particularly had a really great response with this chemotherapy, so it was even beyond just a three-month difference. With that being said, even in patients who are what we call microsatellite-stable, who didn’t have this unique signature, they still saw a benefit with this novel combination, and to add to that, the nice thing about it is the toxicities were not bad. Even this new combination was very well-tolerated. 

It was not a high rate of severe toxicities or side effects, if you will, and that actually, the great majority of patients were able to stay on this therapy and really get through – complete the therapy course. 

So, there are some sort of nuanced differences between the two trials I mentioned, GY018 versus the RUBY. And some of those details are with regards to the even specific subtype of endometrial cancer, which we haven’t talked about yet, for example, uterine carcinosarcoma versus uterine serous carcinoma, uterine clear cell, uterine endometrioid – these are all specific subtypes of endometrial cancer. So there are some nuances where the RUBY trial was able to include patients with uterine carcinosarcoma, whereas the GY018 did not. 

But suffice it to say, now we have enough data that virtually all endometrial cancer patients with advanced stage, regardless of what histology, there is essentially a trial that can apply to you where it demonstrated this added benefit to doing this novel combination, and that was found with microsatellite-stable patients as well as microsatellite-instable in both randomized controlled trials that I mentioned. 

Katherine:

Such exciting news! That’s great! Well, beyond ASCO, Dr. Ko, are there other research or treatment advances that patients should know about?  

Dr. Ko:

Certainly. Like I mentioned, we’re really moving towards the realm of treating with a targeted therapy approach, and within endometrial cancer, the prior paradigm was much simpler, but really not in the space of target therapy. So, for example, what does that mean? 

So, as we’re realizing that there are very unique biologic signatures to different patients’ endometrial cancer – there could be, for example, some cancers that are particularly receptive to hormonal therapy, meaning their specific cancer, when we send it for detailed – we call it genomic or somatic testing, we can discover, oh, they have estrogen-receptor-positive, progesterone-receptor-positive, and so, those type of cancers may be very responsive to hormonal-based therapy, and in that space, we have a standard available drugs, but we also have clinical trials that are trying newer drugs. 

If, for example, the standard aromatase inhibitor or the standard progesterone agent may be helpful, but there are even more in that space that this point – CDK inhibitors that you can combine with these aromatase inhibitors or hormonal agents that have been around for longer that have shown a lot of promise, a lot of data in breast cancer. But now we’re realizing, wow, there could be some efficacy in endometrial cancer as well, so that’s just one example. 

And there’s other unique biologic gene signatures, again, kind of a good list now out there, that are being studied in various clinical trials, whether they’re PARP inhibitors, whether they’re drugs that target CCNE1, whether they’re drugs that target ARID1A, so there are actually many more that are available. So, they’re really expanding the opportunity for treatment for endometrial cancer patients. 

Katherine:

Well, you just mentioned clinical trials, and I think it’s a good topic to cover a little bit. Why is it important for patients to actually consider enrolling? What are the benefits for them? 

Dr. Ko:

Sure.

So, while we certainly have a good armamentarium of standard-of-care therapies already, and I should mention that does include our classic chemotherapy drugs like paclitaxel (Abraxane), carboplatin (Paraplatin), and even doxorubicin (Adriamycin), if you will, or doxorubicin Hcl (Doxil), there are the immunotherapy drugs now that have become standard of care as well, like pembrolizumab (Keytruda), but sometimes, despite using those best available drugs, the cancer unfortunately either continues to grow or you had a good response, but somehow it shows up again – the cancer shows up again – and so, then, we’re looking for additional opportunities, additional therapies. 

And so, some of the best opportunities are actually to consider these clinical trials. The way that clinical trials are designed is that they always are going  to provide you at least a backbone of a standard available therapy, so you’re never going to get less than what would be considered standard of care. 

But, what they’re doing is they’re usually partnering another drug – a more novel therapy – or they’re basically testing a more novel therapy that could be more targeted, that could potentially have better efficacy than what’s already available standardly. And so, the value of that is that you could have an opportunity to have a therapy that could work even better.  

When you’ve tried something already, unfortunately, the cancer has grown, there is still opportunity, and while you’re on a clinical trial, I think one of the huge benefits is it’s very regulated. You are monitored so closely because at the base of all of this is safety. There is never going to be a drug or therapy that’s going to be administered to a patient without ensuring that there’s absolute safety for that patient, and so, that’s a way that you really have opportunity to get more treatment that could really help your cancer condition and do it in a very, very safe, formal fashion. 

Katherine:

And ultimately help others as well, in the future.  

Dr. Ko:

Exactly, absolutely, because as you’re participating in this process – and, of course, it’s a voluntary process to participate on a clinical trial, so we so appreciate all the patients who, in the past, have participated and are willing to participate in the future, but allows us also to really gather a lot of information to really inform cancer treatment for all the patients coming down the road, and those could be anyone. They could be our neighbors, our friends, our own family members, and that could really be so helpful to everyone that’s going through this type of thing. 

Katherine:

Absolutely, yeah. I’d like to back up a bit and talk about what endometrial cancer is. It’s often referred to as uterine cancer. So, are they the same thing? Are these terms interchangeable? 

Dr. Ko:

Sure, it’s a great question. So, endometrial cancer refers to cancer that starts in what I call the lining of the uterine cavity. So, inside the uterus, there’s a uterine cavity, and there’s a tissue that coats that cavity, and that’s called the endometrium. So, endometrial cancer is basically when cancer cells start growing from that tissue. And, of course, since that exists in the uterus, of course, it’s considered uterine cancer, and we’re just being a little bit more specific when we say endometrial cancer. But, of course, endometrial cancer is the most common form of uterine cancer by far, so in some ways, it’s almost – it’s synonymous.  

Katherine:

How is endometrial cancer staged? 

Dr. Ko:

So, the most classic, rigorous way to stage endometrial cancer is through a surgical procedure. So, what that usually involves is it does include a hysterectomy, removing the uterus and the cervix, usually also includes removing the fallopian tubes and the ovaries. 

And, at the same time, the surgeon will do a very thorough assessment of the abdominal pelvic cavity, basically looking around all those areas to see if there’s any signs of visible disease, anything they can see that looks like it could be tumor deposits in the abdominal cavity. If anything is seen, those deposits will be removed and biopsied, so that’s part of the staging procedure. 

And additionally, it’s important to try to assess the lymph nodes, typically. So, there are lymph nodes in the pelvic area, and then, higher up along the aortic area, and so, there are different surgical techniques that we can use to basically test or sample some of those lymph nodes, be able to remove them, send them to the pathologist, look under the microscope to see if there are any microscopic cancer cells that have traveled to those lymph nodes. 

So, that is all part of a surgical procedure, and with all the information collected from those tissue samples that are removed from the body and sent to the pathologist, but the pathologist then reviews all of that under a microscope, and then can issue a very thorough report describing where the cancer cells are located, and by definition, where the cancer cells are located then defines what the stage is of the cancer. 

Katherine:

Can you give me an example? 

Dr. Ko:

Of course. So, for example, if the cancer cells are located only in the uterus, and they’re not found anywhere else, then that is a stage I. If the cancer cells have traveled to the cervix area specifically, this we call a cervical stroma, that becomes a stage II. If the cancer cells have, for example, traveled to the fallopian tubes, or the ovaries, or the lymph nodes, then that becomes a stage III, and there are sort of substages within those categories as well. 

Katherine:

But stage III would be the highest or most severe? 

Dr. Ko:

So, there’s stage III, and then there’s actually stage IV. So, if the cancer cells have traveled outside of the pelvis into the abdominal area, then we consider that a stage IV. 

Katherine:

And that would be considered advanced endometrial cancer? 

Dr. Ko:

Right. So, by definition, “advanced” typically refers to stage III or IV. 

Katherine:

I see, okay. Now that we understand more about the disease itself, I’d like to talk about the treatments that are currently available. You mentioned chemotherapy, but what else is available for people? 

Dr. Ko:

Absolutely. So, treatment for endometrial cancer is usually some combination of surgery, and then it may be followed by possibly chemotherapy, as well as radiation, and sometimes, it may be a combination of all three treatments, or sometimes, it’s a combination of one or two of those, depending on the exact stage, depending on the exact cell type, and some of the other factors. 

Katherine:

Are hormonal therapies used as well, and targeted therapies? 

Dr. Ko:

Yes. 

Katherine:

I know they are in other cancers. 

Dr. Ko:

Yes. And so, I think the question is where do those come into play? So, I would say the usual algorithm most commonly would be that surgery is done first, as the most common first step, and then, based on the information obtained from surgery and the pathology report that comes from that, then there’s usually some type of a recommendation about should there be a second stepped treatment, and that frequently can be chemotherapy/radiation.  

Now, the areas where targeted therapy – for example, immunotherapy – where does that come in? So, that now has come into the – I would call it the second stage. We’re combining it with the classic chemotherapy drugs – Taxol-carboplatin, for example. That’s one example where it could come into play. Another example could come into play where a patient had gone through classic Taxol/paclitaxel and carboplatin, then had cancer come back, and so, that could be another instance where that pembrolizumab or pembro with lenvatinib (Lenvima) combination can be used in the setting of recurrence. 

Now, we could also say, hey, if your cancer type has those hormonal receptors present or is some type of what we call endometrioid histology, and we think that hormonal therapy may be more effective in that case, then that could also be used in a setting where the cancer has kind of grown again, the cancer has grown back, or actually, there are certain situations where patients, for example, may not undergo a hysterectomy. 

And, there are unique cases and those situations where patients are still trying to preserve their fertility, and therefore not wanting to undergo a hysterectomy, or they’re unable to undergo surgery safely. And so, in some unique situations, we may also use hormonal therapy as the mechanism to treat their cancer, and whether that is by way of a pill, whether that is by way of a progesterone intrauterine device, IUD, that is placed into the uterus, we also have situations where we tailor the therapy to the condition of the patient. 

Katherine:

How are patients monitored for a recurrence, and are there approaches to help prevent a recurrence? 

Dr. Ko:

Sure, absolutely. Great question. It is important to continue monitoring patients, even after they’ve gone through treatment. So, I think of it as a multifaceted approach. Usually, it includes office visits, including a physical exam. It includes a thorough intake of all of their symptoms. 

It also includes – depending on the scenario – in some circumstances, regular imaging studies, such as a CT scan or MRI, and sometimes, we also do things like PET scans, and I think that does have to be tailored to the unique patient’s endometrial cancer, unique case, stage, histology, and we kind of tailor which tests we choose to do. The interval of monitoring can vary, so I would say generally speaking, it could be anywhere from three- to six-month visits, and with potentially added scans, as we talked about, and sometimes, we also do certain blood tests in certain cases where we may choose to follow a CA125 blood tumor marker. 

But, I would say that there are different, definitely variants to how we choose to monitor, and there are certain resources we tend to use, such as the NCCN guidelines that providers may reference, and sometimes may even share with the patients to explain why and how we choose to do the monitoring. 

Katherine:

When treating more advanced endometrial cancer disease in general, are the treatment options different than if you were treating somebody who had stage I or stage II, for instance? 

Dr. Ko:

Sure, great question. So, for some patients with, say, stage I, surgery alone is enough. 

For some other patients, subcategories of stage I, where we call them more high/intermediate-risk patients, they’re stage I, but there are a few features about their pathology that might make them slightly higher risk for recurrence – in those cases, we might consider a little bit of radiation after surgery, what we call adjuvant radiation or what we call radiation vaginal brachytherapy. Just three short treatments of a little bit of radiation to the top of the vagina has been shown to possibly decrease chance of recurrence in that area with very minimal side effects. 

So, that would be more commonly in line with stage I. There are some subtypes that can still be what we call high-risk, even in stage I/stage II uterine serous carcinoma, uterine carcinosarcoma. In those cases, we might also recommend chemotherapy along with some vaginal brachytherapy following their hysterectomy, so that’s the early stage. 

And then, with the advanced stage, yes. So, frequently, it’d be surgery first to secure the diagnosis, followed by some type of – it might be primarily chemotherapy, or it could be combination chemotherapy with radiation. And over time, I would say our paradigm for what we use for chemotherapy and radiation has changed a little bit. 

If you go back a couple decades, I think radiation was used a lot – whole pelvic radiation, even just without any chemotherapy. And then, we then had more data from research clinical trials, GOG-258 or PORTEC-3, that then had given us evidence that perhaps doing chemotherapy with some combination of radiation is going to be beneficial, or even moving towards primarily radiation could be a very good option in terms of long-term benefit/long-term survival. 

And, of course, that brings us to the present day, those two trials that I mentioned from ASCO, the GY018 and the RUBY, now bringing in the immunotherapy component to the chemotherapy, so there has definitely been an evolution to managing advanced stage. 

Katherine:

Yes. Dr. Ko, what goes into determining a treatment approach for an individual patient? Is there key testing that helps guide a patient’s prognosis and treatment options? 

Dr. Ko:

Absolutely. So, I think the key pieces of information come from several sources. First, we do take the whole patient into account, like baseline health, baseline function, meaning every day, how active are you? Are there limitations to your daily activities? Looking at baseline health conditions, what we call comorbidities. Are there other health conditions, like diabetes, heart conditions, lung condition, kidney conditions, that could really impact a patient’s overall health and wellbeing? That is always part of it, number one. 

Then, we look specific to the cancer details. So, from all the pathology information, biopsies, followed by a surgical staging procedure, what exact stage, what exact substage, and we might even look at other unique features. Was there cells that got into the lymph vessels, the lymph nodes? Are there other just features from a pathology standpoint that are important, like the – I talked about microsatellite status, microsatellite instable versus microsatellite stable. 

Those are all information we can gather from the tumor tissue itself. That then kind of tailors our therapy. And then, like I was saying, now we’re going into this molecular era where we can actually take that tumor tissue and even do more expanded testing on it. 

So, I think it’s worthwhile to talk to your provider and say, “Hey, would it be worthwhile to send my tumor out for expanded testing, whether it’s done at your institution, at a specialized lab, or whether it’s sent out to a company that does expanded testing?” Because then, they might be able to test for 500 different genetic signatures, a much more broad panel, but that might open the door for opportunities to say, “Hey, you actually do have a very unique signature, and maybe it is worth tailoring your therapy even further.” 

So, I think these are very important questions to have with your provider, and these pieces of information can help guide the prognosis. I think we’re always asking what does this mean long-term, and I think when we have all these individual pieces of information, we can then give guidance on that.  

Katherine:

Well, that leads me into my next question. I wanted to get your point of view on why is it important for patients to engage in their care and their treatment decisions? 

Dr. Ko:

Right. I think that it is so important. Medical treatments, I think, do work the best for the patient when the patient is truly an active participant, and what I mean by that is I think we can really understand the patient if there’s a conversation, there’s a mutual discussion, and I think every patient has unique circumstances, has unique goals, has…whether it’s just the daily whatever responsibilities, or just either health or non-health concerns that they have, we want to be able to find a treatment that fits the patient, and we realize that one treatment doesn’t fit all. 

And so, the more, I think, that there is this mutual discussion, mutual understanding, then there’s a mutual decision treatment plan that is made, and there’s the more ability to modify that plan when – if you realize, oh, maybe we can tailor it, maybe we try one thing, and maybe we realize we got to change a little bit.  

And, I think that with a cancer condition, it is a journey. It is not just a one-time thing. It really is a journey, and I think that the more a patient can participate throughout that journey, I think the better the outcomes for the patient, and honestly, the better the treatment course will be for everyone participating. 

Katherine:

Why should a patient consider finding an endometrial cancer specialist? What are the benefits? 

Dr. Ko:

So, I think naturally, an endometrial cancer specialist is a provider who spends more time thinking about the disease, reading about it, looking at what’s the newest research studies that are coming out, what are the available clinical trials here, locally, regionally, or nationally, what are other support services available for the patient in the space. 

And, of course, probably the folks that do the most surgeries gear towards endometrial cancer patients, and so, I think just working in that space naturally then brings more resources and more opportunity for the patient to kind of really know what’s out there, what is the newest, and I think that really benefits the patient. 

Katherine:

Thank you for sharing all this information. I’d like to close with your thoughts on the future of endometrial cancer care. Are you hopeful? 

Dr. Ko:

Yes. I think that I’m especially hopeful, especially within these last even few years, of where our field is going. I want to say I think there’s so much more that needs to be done.  

I don’t think we’re ready to close the books on endometrial cancer. I think this is just a wonderful opening of a chapter where we’re seeing many more therapies come about. I do think that something that is concerning is that we are seeing more cases of endometrial cancer being diagnosed – yeah, so it is absolutely true. There is very robust data that is collected by our CDC and cancer registry in the country, and it is showing that there is actually a rising incidence, that the number of endometrial cancer cases in this country is actually increasing over time, and it has – 

Katherine:

Why is that? 

Dr. Ko:

It’s a great question. 

Katherine:

Nobody knows – the data doesn’t include that information? 

Dr. Ko:

I think there’s definitely some information, there is definitely information out there. I think some of it – and this is not all of it – I think some of it is related to the increase in obesity and the increase in average weight over time, and this metabolic condition to some degree, I think, does stimulate potential risk for endometrial cancer. 

However, that is not the only reason, and what is concerning is that what we’re seeing is there’s a specific rise in subtypes of endometrial cancer in certain populations, particularly the Black and Hispanic patient populations, and we’re seeing a rise in the most aggressive types of endometrial cancer in those patient populations. I think there’s a lot of research going on right now in that to try to understand why. Is it just because we’re picking it up more? I don’t think that’s the bottom line. 

And, I think what we’re also realizing as we’re studying these various tumor types of endometrial cancer, they are driven by different biology. So, I think to some extent, the ones that are more maybe related to obesity or hormones and all may be slightly different – not completely separate, but that there is underlying different genetic basis for some of these cancers developing, and whether that’s a combination of underlying genes, environment, exposure, or all of the numerous factors, we just know it is happening, and so, it really is critical in my mind that the awareness and the focus and attention on endometrial cancers is really there, that we really think about it, that we share the information as much as possible, and that we can really then come to better – have more opportunity for treatments, be able to diagnose it sooner, be able to have more opportunities to treat it, and honestly, have better survival and outcomes for our patients. 

Katherine:

Dr. Ko, thank you so much for joining us today. You’ve given us so much information. 

Dr. Ko:

Thank you. It was my pleasure. 

Katherine:

And thank you to all of our collaborators. If you would like to watch this webinar again, there will be a replay available soon. You’ll receive an email when it’s ready. And don’t forget to take the survey immediately following this webinar. It will help us as we plan future programs. To learn more about endometrial cancer and to access tools to help you become a proactive patient, visit PowerfulPatients.org. I’m Katherine Banwell. Thanks for joining us.