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Myeloma Treatment & Research Updates From 2022 ASCO and EHA Meetings

Myeloma Treatment & Research Updates From 2022 ASCO and EHA Meetings from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

Myeloma specialist and researcher Dr. Krina Patel discusses highlights from the recent American Society of Clinical Oncology (ASCO) annual meeting and the European Hematology Association (EHA) 2022 Congress. Dr. Patel shares promising research updates related to approaches including: stem cell transplant, CAR T-cell therapy, and bispecifics.

Dr. Krina Patel is an Associate Professor in the Department of Lymphoma/Myeloma at The University of Texas MD Anderson Cancer Center in Houston, Texas. Dr. Patel is involved in research and cares for patients with multiple myeloma. Learn more about Dr. Patel, here.

Related Resources:

How Does Immunotherapy Treat Myeloma?

What Is Myeloma CAR T-Cell Therapy?

Immunotherapy: Which Myeloma Patients Is It Right For?

Transcript:

Katherine:   

Dr. Patel, cancer researchers recently came together at the annual ASCO and EHA meetings. Are there any highlights from the meetings that myeloma patients should know about?

Dr. Patel:    

Yeah, so we had some amazing trials that were presented at both. And I got to actually go to Chicago for the ASCO meeting, and I’ll say we actually had a plenary session that was presented for myeloma. That doesn’t happen as often as we like. So, basically that was a study presented by Dana-Farber and all of the different groups around the U.S. that did a transplant study. And basically, they’re looking at patients who got induction therapy when they’re newly diagnosed with transplant versus they didn’t get transplant upfront. And it’s called the determination study, and it was to determine should everybody be getting a stem cell transplant.

Katherine:  

Right.

Dr. Patel:   

And this is a trial that’s been going on for over 10 years; that’s why it was so highly anticipated. And basically, the biggest thing that we saw was what we call progression-free survival; so, the time that the myeloma hibernates is what I call it, for PFS. Basically, patients who got transplant upfront, it was 21 months longer that it stayed hibernating than if you didn’t get transplant upfront. So, that’s the trial, that’s what it was looking at, and that’s all they could really say about it. The good news is, even patients who didn’t get transplant upfront but then got transplant in second remission tended to have a really good, long progression-free survival or hibernation in that second remission.

So, it still tells us that right now, a transplant is still important for the majority of our myeloma patients. And basically, that’s sort of what that trial showed.

Now, the difference is we do different types of upfront therapies and we have new things like CAR T and bispecifics that are coming up earlier. So, we’ll see in the future if it still holds up. But as of right now, it still holds up for transplant. The other big studies, of course, were some of our bispecific studies that use different antigens. So, antigens are the flags that are on the myeloma that we make these receptors for CAR T, so they can find the myeloma, or bispecifics go after that.

And basically, there are other antigens. BCMA, B-cell maturation antigen, is the big one that we use for everything right now. But now, we found even more antigens, which is fantastic.

So, we have something called FcHR5. We have something called GPRC5D. It’s like alphabet number soup, basically. But what’s really exciting is that these new antigens give us a different way of getting to that myeloma, especially if someone has already had a BCMA therapy and they’ve relapsed on that. Well, now we have even new ways to get to that myeloma cell. So, I think that’s some really, really exciting data.

And then, I’ll say the other big one was one of the CAR Ts, Cilta-Cel was something that they presented.

Again, this was two years after the last patient had gotten treated on the trial. And so far, they still have about 71 percent of patients that are still in remission two years after. So, that is huge.

Katherine:                  

Wow.

Dr. Patel:  

We’ve never seen that in relapsed refractory patients before, so we’re really, really excited to kind of have gotten that data to say, “Okay, we found a brand-new way of treating myeloma.” And it really is changing how we’re looking at even earlier lines of therapy now.

Katherine:   

Such promising news. That’s great.

What Are the Side Effects of Myeloma Immunotherapy?

What Are the Side Effects of Myeloma Immunotherapy? from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

Myeloma specialist and researcher Dr. Krina Patel discusses the common side effects of immunotherapy and reviews tools that may be used to prevent complications.

Dr. Krina Patel is an Associate Professor in the Department of Lymphoma/Myeloma at The University of Texas MD Anderson Cancer Center in Houston, Texas. Dr. Patel is involved in research and cares for patients with multiple myeloma. Learn more about Dr. Patel, here.

Related Resources:

How Does Immunotherapy Treat Myeloma?

What Is Myeloma CAR T-Cell Therapy?

Myeloma Treatment & Research Updates From 2022 ASCO and EHA Meetings

Transcript:

Katherine:   

Are there other side effects that patients should know about and side effects that they might experience?

Dr. Patel:  

Yeah, so neurotoxicity is one that we don’t see as much as we see in lymphoma patients, which is again great but sometimes people can get something called ICANS, which is a type of neurotoxicity in the first 30 days after CAR T.

And basically, it can be as bad as seizures, but thankfully we don’t see that very often, or I haven’t seen it at all. But it can cause confusion. It can cause people to be extra sleepy. So, we have different treatments that we give to turn that around. Longer term, really, the big side effects are the counts being low. So, what we call cytopenias. So, white count, hemoglobin, platelets.

And so, that is something we see quite often in our patients who have had a lot of therapy for myeloma already, and then are getting something like CAR T.

So, a lot of my patients will still need transfusions even a month or two or three after, and we’re giving GCSF to help their white count come back up, et cetera.

Katherine:    

What’s that?

Dr. Patel: 

So, G-CSF is basically a growth factor that helps your neutrophil; so, a different type of white blood cell – come back up, which helps fight against bacterial infections.

So, it’s the same medicine for anyone who’s had a stem cell transplant. It’s the same medicine you get to get your stem cells into your blood but it’s at a lower dose. But again, it’s to avoid infections, to help present bacterial infections. The other one is infections can also be caused because of low IgG levels or what we call immunoglobulins; these are our antibodies that we have.

And the good news is, when CAR Ts or bispecifics or some of these immune therapies work really well, they’ll kill as many myeloma cells as we possibly can.

But they also kill good cells. So, they kill good plasma cells that make us antibodies and good B cells that make us antibodies. So, when that happens, people’s IgG levels will go down and that puts you at risk for infection too. So, we actually aggressively give people IVIG to help prevent those infections.

Immunotherapy: Which Myeloma Patients Is It Right For?

Immunotherapy: Which Myeloma Patients Is It Right For? from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

Dr. Krina Patel, a myeloma specialist and researcher, explains how newer therapies, such as CAR T-cell therapy, are being used in myeloma and which patients these treatments are most appropriate for.

Dr. Krina Patel is an Associate Professor in the Department of Lymphoma/Myeloma at The University of Texas MD Anderson Cancer Center in Houston, Texas. Dr. Patel is involved in research and cares for patients with multiple myeloma. Learn more about Dr. Patel, here.

Related Resources:

How Does Immunotherapy Treat Myeloma?

What Are the Side Effects of Myeloma Immunotherapy?

Myeloma Treatment & Research Updates From 2022 ASCO and EHA Meetings

Transcript:

Katherine:   

Now, in reference to immunotherapy and CAR T-cell therapy, who are these types of treatments right for?

Dr. Patel:    

So, I think it’s really exciting that we finally are getting standard of care therapies for all these new immune therapies. So, our first CAR T for myeloma got approved a little over a year ago. Our second CAR T got approved just a couple of months ago, and we’re hoping our first bispecific will be approved in just a couple months.

Our fingers crossed. On the clinical trials, I will say our patients who had a good performance status, meaning they’re able to do everything else normally life-wise, those are the patients that got onto those clinical trials; and the reason is safety-wise.

So, T cells when we use them to kill myeloma, they release cytokines or enzymes, you can say, that are inside the T cells and that’s what they use to communicate with other immune cells to come help them kill.

Those are the same cytokines that make people feel really ill when they have the flu, for instance. So, as our immune system tries to fight infections when people get fevers, they feel chills, they feel just fatigued and tired, it’s those same kind of cytokines that, even when you try to kill the myeloma with T cells, people can get that same type of symptoms.

And really, the main, fevers and things like that, we can take care of. But when patients’ blood pressure drops or if their oxygen levels drop really low, that’s where we can run into some trouble. Now, the good news is, in myeloma, most of these new therapies don’t cause really bad CRS [Cytokine Release Syndrome] or really bad neurotoxicity that we can sometimes see. And so, thankfully most patients are okay, but really it’s making sure that none of our patients have bad toxicity. So, most of our myeloma patients, I will say, are eligible for these therapies. However, if someone has really bad heart disease or really bad lung disease, those are patients that maybe these are not the right therapies for.

What Is Myeloma CAR T-Cell Therapy?

What Is Myeloma CAR T-Cell Therapy? from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

How does CAR (chimeric antigen receptor) T-cell therapy work to fight myeloma? Dr. Krina Patel, a myeloma specialist and researcher, explains how this novel therapy uses your immune system to treat the disease.

Dr. Krina Patel is an Associate Professor in the Department of Lymphoma/Myeloma at The University of Texas MD Anderson Cancer Center in Houston, Texas. Dr. Patel is involved in research and cares for patients with multiple myeloma. Learn more about Dr. Patel, here.

Related Resources:

How Does Immunotherapy Treat Myeloma?

Immunotherapy: Which Myeloma Patients Is It Right For?

Myeloma Treatment & Research Updates From 2022 ASCO and EHA Meetings

Transcript:

Katherine:   

What is CAR T-cell therapy?

Dr. Patel:    

So, CAR-T cells are sort of a biologic immune therapy where we are able to take T cells, a type of lymphocyte which help us, normally. All of us have them in our blood.

They come from our bone marrow, go into our blood, and they sort of go around in the blood and look for bad things, pathogens. So, infections, even cancer cells, our T cells help get rid of all of those bad things that we’re not supposed to have. And they each have a receptor. And so, T cells have this night vision, and they’re made for a specific type of pathogen out there that we aren’t supposed to have that can hurt us.

And so, what we can is to either take your own T cells out, or sometimes with something called allo CAR-T use a normal donor’s T cells. And when we take them, we basically can put a new receptor in there, a new night vision; and so, now they are trained to go after something that’s specific on the myeloma instead of a bacteria or a virus or anything. And basically, we grow those cells, and then we give those cells back to our patient after a low dose of chemotherapy, just so these T cells can go in, find the myeloma, use that night vision to find that myeloma wherever it is, kill, and then it actually causes other immune cells in your system to come there and start helping to kill as well.

And then, they start coming back down again. And so, really, it’s a novel way of using your own immune system, or somebody else’s, but to actually enhance both by the target to get that myeloma precisely as well as making more of them so that there’s enough to go around and kill all the cells that we possibly can.

How Does Immunotherapy Treat Myeloma?

How Does Immunotherapy Treat Myeloma? from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

Immunotherapy harnesses one’s own immune system to fight cancer. Dr. Krina Patel, a myeloma specialist and researcher, explains how this therapy changing the treatment landscape for myeloma.

Dr. Krina Patel is an Associate Professor in the Department of Lymphoma/Myeloma at The University of Texas MD Anderson Cancer Center in Houston, Texas. Dr. Patel is involved in research and cares for patients with multiple myeloma. Learn more about Dr. Patel, here.

Related Resources:

What Is Myeloma CAR T-Cell Therapy?

Immunotherapy: Which Myeloma Patients Is It Right For?

What Are the Side Effects of Myeloma Immunotherapy?

Transcript:

Katherine:   

We’ve been hearing a lot recently about immunotherapy. Would you tell us what it is and how it works to treat myeloma?

Dr. Patel:       

Yeah, so I think immunotherapy is sort of where everything is  really changing the way we look at myeloma. So, I’ll date myself a little bit, but 15 years ago when I was a first-year fellow most people thought that immunotherapy wouldn’t necessarily work for myeloma. So, in all cancer care we have surgery possibly in myeloma.

We don’t use it as much, but if someone has a bone lesion that we need to do we might do some surgery there. We use radiation sometimes if we really need, for painful lesions or something that might be at risk for fracture. And we use chemotherapy all the time for treatment.

Immunotherapy is actually different types of medications. Some are proteins. Some are biologics that we can talk about it. But really, they harness your immune cells, all the other white blood cells that are in your bone marrow and in your blood, to actually go after the myeloma themselves. And so, there’s different ways we can do that. And, again, 15 years ago most people said, “No, we’re not going to be able to use immune therapy for myeloma because plasma cells,” which are myeloma cells, “are a white blood cell. So, their sisters, brothers, cousins, whatever you want to call those other white blood cells, how do we turn those into the enemy, or how do we make myeloma the enemy?”

And so, it took a long time for us to figure it out, but really, it’s about using your immune cells to kill that myeloma.

Myeloma Induction and Consolidation Therapy Defined

Myeloma Induction and Consolidation Therapy Defined from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

Myeloma expert, Dr. Krina Patel, defines the role and purpose of induction therapy and consolidation therapy in myeloma care.

Dr. Krina Patel is an Associate Professor in the Department of Lymphoma/Myeloma at The University of Texas MD Anderson Cancer Center in Houston, Texas. Dr. Patel is involved in research and cares for patients with multiple myeloma. Learn more about Dr. Patel, here.

Related Resources:

Expert Advice for Newly Diagnosed Myeloma Patients

The Role of a Myeloma Specialist on Your Care Team

Relapsed and Refractory Myeloma Defined

Transcript:

Katherine:    

What is induction therapy?

Dr. Patel:      

So, induction therapy is usually referred for newly diagnosed patients who have never had therapy before and we are now trying to give something to knock that myeloma down. A diagnosis usually is when we have the most myeloma for somebody because they really didn’t know necessarily that they had myeloma before. And our goal is to knock that myeloma down, so it doesn’t cause any more clinical problems.

Katherine:  

What is consolidation therapy?

Dr. Patel:     

So, consolidation means that we’ve knocked that myeloma down now and we’re trying to keep it down, or there’s a little bit of myeloma left that maybe that initial induction therapy didn’t kill; that we try to kind of sweep it all up with the consolidation. So, usually the best example that I can give of consolidation therapy is high-dose melphalan (Alkeran) with stem cell rescuer or what we call autologous stem cell transplant. That, for patients who are in some type of response; then we do that transplant to really kill as many myeloma cells as possible. And then, we do maintenance.

The other part of consolidation therapy is, sometimes after transplant for some of our high-risk patients, or for patients that still have some myeloma even after stem cell transplant, we might give them three or four drugs again to knock the rest of that myeloma down for a little while. Sometimes we do four cycles or so. So, that’s another consolidation strategy.

Katherine:   

How long is a cycle?

Dr. Patel:      

So, each therapy is different but most of our different myeloma therapies cycles are either three or four weeks.

Relapsed and Refractory Myeloma Defined

Relapsed and Refractory Myeloma Defined from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

Myeloma expert Dr. Krina Patel reviews the difference between relapsed and refractory myeloma and how these distinctions may impact care and treatment.

Dr. Krina Patel is an Associate Professor in the Department of Lymphoma/Myeloma at The University of Texas MD Anderson Cancer Center in Houston, Texas. Dr. Patel is involved in research and cares for patients with multiple myeloma. Learn more about Dr. Patel, here.

Related Resources:

Expert Advice for Newly Diagnosed Myeloma Patients

The Role of a Myeloma Specialist on Your Care Team

Myeloma Induction and Consolidation Therapy Defined

Transcript:

Katherine:  

Dr. Patel, could you define what relapsed myeloma is?

Dr. Patel:     

Yes, so as of today, for the majority of our patients we can’t cure myeloma to the point where we treat it, and it’s gone forever, right? I’m hoping one day we get there. And we’re getting better, but we’re not there yet. However, myeloma’s very, very treatable. So, what relapsed means is that, once you’ve had initial therapy after you’ve been diagnosed, our goal is to get that myeloma to as low as possible level so that it hibernates as long as possible. But eventually, that myeloma’s going to start waking back up. So, when it does, that’s called a relapse. That now, the proteins are coming up, the myeloma cells are growing and we need to do something to knock it back down again. So, that’s relapsed disease.

Katherine:

How is that different from refractory myeloma?

Dr. Patel:

That’s a great question. We talk about relapsed refractory all the time for myeloma. So, refractory actually means that your myeloma started waking up while on a certain medication. So, if you were on no medicines and then your myeloma came up, that’s considered relapsed. That’s not refractory. However, biggest example I can give you is when patients are on maintenance therapy after stem cell transplant, for instance. When they’re all on maintenance and their myeloma starts coming up while on maintenance, then they are considered refractory to that drug; so, if it’s lenalidomide (Revlimid), if it’s bortezomib (Velcade), whichever one it is.

So, any time the myeloma’s coming up while on active treatment, you become refractory. So, we talk about triple refractory or penta-refractory, and what that really means is how many drugs is your myeloma refractory to.

So, if you’re refractory to a proteasome inhibitor plus an immunomodulatory drug plus a CD38 antibody, right – I can give you examples of all of those, but basically different categories –then you’re considered triple refractory. And the more refractory it is, the harder it is to treat and the more novel therapies we need.

Katherine:

So, if a patient is taking three or four different drugs, how can you pin it down to know which drug or all of them are causing the refractory myeloma?

Dr. Patel:

So, it would be all of them. Let’s say, salvage therapy. You’re on three different medications or four different medications, usually three. We would say, if the myeloma’s coming up while you’re on all of them, you’re technically refractory to now all those medications.

Katherine:

All of those. Okay, all right.

The Role of a Myeloma Specialist on Your Care Team

The Role of a Myeloma Specialist on Your Care Team from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

Why should you seek a consultation with a myeloma expert? Dr. Krina Patel discusses the important roles a specialist can play in your myeloma care, even from a distance.

Dr. Krina Patel is an Associate Professor in the Department of Lymphoma/Myeloma at The University of Texas MD Anderson Cancer Center in Houston, Texas. Dr. Patel is involved in research and cares for patients with multiple myeloma. Learn more about Dr. Patel, here.

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Expert Advice for Newly Diagnosed Myeloma Patients

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Transcript:

Katherine:  

You mentioned the healthcare team. Dr. Patel. How does a myeloma specialist fit into that care team?

Dr. Patel:

So, I will say, as a myeloma specialist, I probably have three different ways that I am involved in different patient’s care. So, I have patients who are from Houston, where I’m at, that come to MD Anderson for their treatment. So, I see them on a regular basis if they’re on treatment, or I’m following them to make sure their disease is stable, what’s going on. So, I see them regularly, and I’m their main doctor for their cancer. And then, I have patients who are maybe a little bit farther away, and I see them as part of the team.

So, they have their own oncologist in their community that they’re seeing and they come see me either virtually or in person every few months, or if something’s happening; if their myeloma’s returning or they’re having toxicity, then they reach out to me so I can talk about different ways we can change therapy. And then, the third really is for second opinions where patients don’t necessarily  want to come see me all the time but they might want to be on a clinical trial that we might have at MD Anderson. So, they come just for that trial and then they go back to their doctors again. So, we sort of do whatever works best for the patient.

Expert Advice for Newly Diagnosed Myeloma Patients

Expert Advice for Newly Diagnosed Myeloma Patients from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

Myeloma expert and researcher Dr. Krina Patel shares key advice for patients newly diagnosed with myeloma, encouraging patients to take an active role in their care.

Dr. Krina Patel is an Associate Professor in the Department of Lymphoma/Myeloma at The University of Texas MD Anderson Cancer Center in Houston, Texas. Dr. Patel is involved in research and cares for patients with multiple myeloma. Learn more about Dr. Patel, here.

Related Resources:

The Role of a Myeloma Specialist on Your Care Team

Relapsed and Refractory Myeloma Defined

Myeloma Induction and Consolidation Therapy Defined

Transcript:

Katherine:  

Myeloma can be a complex diagnosis. What are three key pieces of advice for patients who has just been diagnosed with myeloma?

Dr. Patel: 

I think any diagnosis of cancer, of course, is really hard, but multiple myeloma is so rare in the sense that people don’t know about it; that sometimes it’s the first time they’ve heard of it, when they’re diagnosed. And so, I think the biggest thing about more rare diseases in general, the best advice I could give is getting a myeloma specialist as part of your team. That doesn’t mean they have to treat you, but having them as part of your team. And we can talk about that in more detail. But the second part is really learning as much as you can and not necessarily all on the Internet.

Not everything on the Internet is correct. But really asking questions to your doctors, your nurse practitioners, your nurses, they all have different perspectives that asking questions for all of them is really worthwhile to kind of understand what you’re going through and what’s to be expected. And then, the last piece. I think with multiple myeloma patients, there are so many amazing patient support systems, especially after COVID but even before COVID, in terms of different groups that are sponsored by patients where you can listen when people come to give talks, et cetera. I think those are all phenomenal resources for patients.

Katherine: 

What do you think the role is of the patient in their own care?

Dr. Patel:     

So, gone are the days of paternalistic medicine, especially in the U.S. My job is not to tell you what to do, but my job is to really give you options as to what is the best possible therapy for you at that time. And really, your job is, as a patient, to make sure that they tell me all the information that’s important for them. So, for instance, if they can’t come to chemo every week because they just don’t have a ride or they have some other medical problems that maybe I didn’t know about, those types of things. We just have to have that open communication, so we can come to that best next therapy together with those decisions.

An Overview of Current DLBCL Treatment Approaches

An Overview of Current DLBCL Treatment Approaches from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

What do diffuse large B-cell lymphoma (DLBCL) patients need to know about current treatment approaches? Expert Dr. Loretta Nastoupil provides an overview and gives an update about ongoing research comparing two treatment regimens.

Dr. Loretta Nastoupil is Director of the Lymphoma Outcomes Database in the Department of Lymphoma/Myeloma at The University of Texas MD Anderson Cancer Center. Learn more about Dr. Nastoupil, here.

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Transcript:

Katherine:

Dr. Nastoupil, now that we’ve discussed factors that go into the treatment choices, can you walk us through the currently available DLBCL treatment approaches and who they might be right for?

Dr. Nastoupil:

Absolutely. So, again, this is changing, and that’s good news. So, up until recently, R-CHOP or rituximab in combination with CHOP, which is an acronym for four different drugs, cyclophosphamide, doxorubicin, vincristine, and prednisone, has been our standard.

Again, what would potentially challenge that is the POLARIX study where we exchange vincristine for polatuzumab. We don’t know the results of that study yet. All we know is that it met its primary endpoint, meaning it met what it set out to do in terms of improving upon some of the outcomes achieved with R-CHOP.

We need to see the details to know if that means now every newly diagnosed diffuse large B-cell lymphoma patient will be offered the polatuzumab in combination with R-CHP study or whether or not there will still be some patients appropriate for R-CHOP.

But that is generally our first approach. Whether you get six cycles or a shortened course plus/minus radiation depends on your state. Once patients have completed therapy, generally, then we pursue what’s called surveillance.

So, we’re monitoring for any signs that the lymphoma has recurred or has not gone away. That’s a controversial topic in terms of how to conduct surveillance and one that I suspect will change over time. But for most patients, if the lymphoma is going to recur, it generally recurs within the first two years.

So, assessing patients either in the form of a CT scan, a PET CT, or a physical exam with labs every four to six months for the first two years is what most practices will pursue. I’m not saying that there is no chance that you would relapse beyond two years. It’s just that the majority of patients, at least 90 percent, if the lymphoma comes back, it usually does so within two years.

And the relapses that occur beyond two years are less predictable. They could happen at three years. They could happen at 10 years, as it’s hard to know how to do surveillance beyond two years.

If the lymphoma recurs, the first thing we need to do is biopsy it because there are many things that can mimic lymphoma on a scan – infection, inflammation, other tumor types. So, if there is ever a question about whether or not the lymphoma has recurred, I generally advise for all patients they undergo a biopsy to ensure that we know what we’re treating.

Depending on when the lymphoma recurs, if it happens within 12 months, this is another area that we are shifting our practice. In the past, for all patients who had relapsed large cell lymphoma, we would pursue what we call salvage or second-line chemotherapy. So, we mix up the chemo. We keep, generally, the rituximab, but we alter the chemotherapy agents. We wouldn’t give CHOP again.

And then we give a shortened course where we give two to three cycles. We repeat the scan. And for patients who’ve achieved what we call chemo-sensitive disease – so, that’s generally a complete response on scan – we would then move forward with high-dose therapy and an autologous stem cell transplant. So, essentially giving different but more intense chemo and rescuing patients from that maneuver with their own stem cells that will go back to the bone marrow and start making white blood cells, red cells, and platelets again.

What has shifted in the last six months is we now know that CAR T-cell therapy is superior to that approach, at least with two CAR Ts for patients whose lymphoma came back within 12 months. Again, we’re eagerly awaiting the full results of those randomized studies. But three trials were conducted. Two of the three suggest CAR T is better than second chemo and transplant for those patients who relapse within 12 months.

So, currently, we think that you’ll have a CHOP-like therapy with plus rituximab frontline. If you progress within 12 months, you potentially would be a candidate for CAR T-cell therapy. If the CAR T-cell therapy fails, which is true for about half of patients. Or if you’re deemed to not be a candidate for CAR T, we have several other new options that didn’t exist a year ago, including targeted or non-chemotherapy options.

So, there are at least four options in that setting now that are therapies that target the lymphoma cells, either by targeting CD19, which is another surface marker, augmenting that either with an antibody drug conjugate, such as loncastuximab tesirine (Lonca), or with an immune therapy, such as lenalidomide (Revlimid) and tafasitamab. Polatuzumab (Polivy) is available in that third line or later space combined with bendamustine (Treanda) and rituximab (Rituxan). There’s an oral agent called Selinexor (Xpovio).

So, a lot of that is not to burden patients with information but to let them know they’ve got lots of options. And many of these can be sequenced. So, if we can’t achieve cure with R-CHOP and/or CAR T, there are still very good outcomes in that third line or later space. 

The Benefits of Having a Role in Your DLBCL Treatment Decisions

The Benefits of Having a Role in Your DLBCL Treatment Decisions from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

Diffuse large B-cell lymphoma (DLBCL) patients have a vital role in their treatment decisions. Expert Dr. Loretta Nastoupil shares advice for patients on how to advocate for their best care, the value of a second opinion, and credible resources to boost knowledge about DLBCL.

Diffuse large B-cell lymphoma (DLBCL) patients have a vital role in their treatment decisions. Expert Dr. Loretta Nastoupil shares advice for patients on how to advocate for their best care, the value of a second opinion, and credible resources to boost knowledge about DLBCL.

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Transcript:

Katherine:

But what do you feel is the patient’s role in this whole decision?

Dr. Nastoupil:

So, I’ve actually been a patient myself, and I have mixed feelings about it. I think oftentimes as an oncologist, we share decision-making when we don’t know the exact path forward, meaning if there’s something controversial or you have more than one option, generally, we kind of put out all the information to the patient, and we want you to be part of that decision-making.

And I think that’s important because we’re all humans, and we all want liberties. And we want our patient rights to be acknowledged and respected. And that’s important. I think sometimes though that also burdens patients with making decisions when they may feel they don’t have all of the information to make an informed decision.

But your role as the patient is you know your body better than anyone. And, generally, if there’s something that just doesn’t fit well or sit well with you, be vocal about it. So, I’ve been in a situation where I felt like I had to speak up a few times, and not that I have all the answers. And I am an oncologist. So, I generally have more insight than others.

But, generally, I was right in that, again, I think we know our own bodies. And when you feel that something is being missed or maybe not given the time and attention it deserves, speak up. You also have a role in making sure that the diagnosis is correct.

So, I generally advise all patients because everything hinges on the diagnosis in lymphoma, more so than the staging, more so than sometimes even the treatment itself.

Getting a second opinion can be incredibly valuable because you have another pathologist that will lay eyes on this biopsy. And lymphoma is rare. So, a second opinion can be incredibly valuable, and that’s usually something driven by a patient more so than an oncologist. Though some oncologists – and I would say the majority – are open to an opinion because they too would like information or confirmation that they’re on the right path.

Katherine:

Certainly.

Dr. Nastoupil:

The other thing that I think patients can have role is exploring what trial options are out there and available to them. I think that is sometimes a tough subject to discuss. Clinical trials are not only for patients who have failed all the standard treatments.

And it’s usually not an option of hospice versus a clinical trial. That’s absolutely an inappropriate time to consider a clinical trial. And, generally, there are trials at any point in a patient’s journey where there is some controversy as to the best path forward.

Again, I’ve been discussing the last 40 years of trying to improve upon R-CHOP is because 60 percent of patients were cured, but 40 percent were not. There is always a scenario where we could do better. And, generally, the only way we will improve upon outcomes is to conduct important rational clinical trials.

So, sometimes, it’s as simple as reaching out, participating in programs such as this, reaching out to The Lymphoma & Leukemia Society or the Lymphoma Research Foundation to just explore what are your trial options. They may not be appropriate for you right now, but at least understanding where there is an opportunity to participate in a trial is worth exploring.

Katherine:

Dr. Nastoupil, I’m wondering how patients can feel confident in speaking up and becoming a partner in their care?

Dr. Nastoupil:

So, it’s important to recognize, and I reflect on this all the time. Generally, once patients have been rendered a diagnosis of cancer, that’s a life-altering event. And even if I spend a lot of time trying to reassure patients that outcomes for lymphoma patients are very good, generally we’re aiming for cure, that’s not true for everyone.

And you can’t help but be concerned that you will succumb to this disease or that the toxicity of therapy is going to be life-altering and impact your quality of life in such a way that it’s no longer the life that you were happy to live.

And so, I recognize that we are partners in this. My job is to choose the most effective therapy that will try and accomplish the goals we set out to achieve. However, sometimes, oncologists make assumptions about what the goal of a given patient is.

We’re assuming that longevity or living is the most important goal. Whereas sometimes, people might care more about the quality of life, or they may need more reassurances about what the options are or their realistic outcomes with therapy. Because, again, I’ve mentioned before, oncologists are generally eternal optimists. We tend to sugarcoat things a little bit.

So, it’s important for patients to recognize that they will have a shared decision responsibility, meaning oftentimes we will provide all the information that we have access to in terms of a given treatment.

What is the likelihood of success, what is the potential risk in terms of toxicity, and what we’re leaning towards one therapy over another, particularly if you have more than one option.

But, ultimately, we need patients to share with us what their goals are in terms of outcome of that treatment so that we can then potentially refine our treatment selection. So, again, being informed, participating in programs like this so that you understand what makes one lymphoma different from another. Why would one oncologist offer one treatment and another discuss something else?

So, understanding what the different lymphomas are, how they might be approached differently, what the new therapies are. I struggle to keep up with just the lymphoma literature and changes. I can’t imagine what it must be like for an oncologist that treats every cancer type. So, again, understanding that new drugs are approved almost every couple of months in lymphoma may provide an opportunity for patients to share new information with their oncologists as well. 

Should DLBCL Treatment Begin Immediately?

Should DLBCL Treatment Begin Immediately? from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

For a newly diagnosed diffuse large B-cell lymphoma (DLBCL) patient, should treatment begin right away? Expert Dr. Loretta Nastoupil discusses the optimal time to begin treatment and how it can vary by patient situation.

Dr. Loretta Nastoupil is Director of the Lymphoma Outcomes Database in the Department of Lymphoma/Myeloma at The University of Texas MD Anderson Cancer Center. Learn more about Dr. Nastoupil, here.

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Transcript:

Katherine:

Does treatment typically start right away?

Dr. Nastoupil:

Hopefully. So, what I mean by that is everyone has to have a diagnosis. And a common story that I hear is that patients generally know when they’re not doing well. They may not be able to pinpoint I have lymphoma.

But they usually will see a primary care doctor or depending on the location of a lymph node if it’s palpable. Oftentimes, men when they’re shaving will pick up a lymph node in the neck. Or women if they’re having a mammogram will pick up a lymph node in the axillae or under the arm. So, that may lead to further investigation based off the location of a lymph node.

Or it may just be those constitutional symptoms where people aren’t feeling well, and a primary care doctor is their first stop. Lymphoma is rare. So, usually it’s a diagnosis of exclusion or something that we eventually get around to. That is important, but it’s not that important.

So, what I mean by that is I hope patients don’t have any guilt or regret if they’ve been sitting on symptoms for a while or even if their primary care doctor missed signs and symptoms of lymphoma because, again, it’s not very specific. There are a lot of things that can cause similar presentations.

But once we have imaging that is suggestive of lymphoma and then we have a diagnosis that’s rendered, again, followed by a biopsy, generally, then it is important that they seek care.

And they get that care in a timely fashion. What’s kind of interesting is the longer time from diagnosis to the initiation of treatment in diffuse large B-cell lymphoma is usually associated with a better prognosis. So, that’s sort of counterintuitive.

One would think that the sooner you get started on treatment, the better your outcome will be. I think the challenge with interpreting that data is that the longer time from diagnosis to initiation of treatment usually means that that patient’s disease is one that lends itself to the affordability of time to be seen by specialists, have all of your staging studies completed, have a return visit to go over all those results and have a shared decision-making process in terms of deciding what’s the best treatment for you, and then getting started on that treatment.

So, those patients where that is agreeable and acceptable, they’re probably going to do very well.

For the patients who are really sick and they need to get started on treatment sooner rather later as a result of their disease putting them at risk, either as a result of organs not functioning well or substantial symptom burden as a result of their disease, then they need to get started. So, that’s usually why their course from diagnosis to treatment is generally shorter.

So, again, it all kind of depends on a given situation. But with diffuse large B-cell lymphoma, I tell patients usually within three months of knowing you have lymphoma, we need to get you on treatment, or you’re going to be sick 

How Does Biomarker Testing Impact DLBCL Treatment Options?

How Does Biomarker Testing Impact DLBCL Treatment Options? from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

Biomarker test results may help guide diffuse large B-cell lymphoma (DLBCL) treatment options. Expert Dr. Loretta Nastoupil explains how biomarkers are currently used in determining an optimal treatment approach and how research efforts could help create more precise treatments.

Dr. Loretta Nastoupil is Director of the Lymphoma Outcomes Database in the Department of Lymphoma/Myeloma at The University of Texas MD Anderson Cancer Center. Learn more about Dr. Nastoupil, here.

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Transcript:

Katherine:

What about biomarker testing results?

Dr. Nastoupil:

So, in a perfect world, we would be able to take a patient’s specific tumor, sequence it, and provide a recipe or a solution to solve the problem. And that’s what a biomarker is.

It’s something that’s unique to the patient’s given tumor that then would inform what is the best treatment. So, we’re lacking in some ways a perfect scenario. What we do have, as what I’ve mentioned, some molecular studies where we can look for specific genes or rearrangements in the genes that may help us predict the future.

And in diffuse large B-cell lymphoma, one of the most common examples of this is what we call double hit where we’re looking for two genes – MYC, which is M-Y-C, and either BCL-2 or BCL-6. These are genes that we all have. It’s just the lymphoma has moved these genes into sort of more of a prime real estate location that makes it a little bit more resistant to standard treatments.

So, if you move those genes in that tumor DNA, we call that our rearrangement. And we pick that up based off a FISH study. And if both of those features or all three of those features are there, we call it a double or triple hit.

That’s a potential biomarker that may suggest that particularly R-CHOP or standard treatment may not be the best strategy. There’s some limitations to that conclusion in that that’s not true for every patient. For about 20 percent to 30 percent of patients with double hit features, they’re going to do really well with R-CHOP.

So, that’s why we are lacking in how effective these biomarkers are. And it would be great if we had additional biomarkers that were more precise or could tell us more than just that the standard may not be optimal.

So, that’s where we’re spending a great deal of time and effort in our research efforts just trying to identify biomarkers that may tell us what’s the best approach for a given patient or what we like to call personalized medicine. 

What Are the Stages of DLBCL?

What Are the Stages of DLBCL? from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

Diffuse large B-cell lymphoma (DLBCL) care involves the use of a specific staging system. Expert Dr. Loretta Nastoupil shares insight about the DLBCL staging system and explains what is occurring in the body during each stage.

Dr. Loretta Nastoupil is Director of the Lymphoma Outcomes Database in the Department of Lymphoma/Myeloma at The University of Texas MD Anderson Cancer Center. Learn more about Dr. Nastoupil, here.

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How Is Diffuse Large B-Cell Lymphoma (DLBCL) Treated?


Transcript:

Katherine:

What are the stages of DLBCL?

Dr. Nastoupil:

So, we currently use what’s called the Ann Arbor staging system. And, again, this is very different from the staging applied in solid tumors.

And so, the way we define stage is based off where the tumor is in relationship to the diaphragm. So, if you have the disease just in lymph nodes and it’s all confined to one side of the diaphragm, it’s either going to be stage I or II. And how we distinguish between I or II is just really not are they in close proximity and something that we would fit in one radiation field.

If you have disease that’s above and below the diaphragm, that’s generally at least stage III. stage IV is generally when it’s now outside of the lymph node. So, what we call extranodal location. So, those are generally organs, lung, liver, skin, bone, etcetera.

It can be very complicated in that you could have just one extranodal site. So, say you just have stomach involvement, or you just have one area of the bone. That could be a 1E.

So, it’s important to recognize every patient has a stage. What that means is whether or not we would give a full course of therapy in terms of systemic treatment that goes through the vein or maybe a shortened course in radiation is dependent on that stage. 

What Are the Goals of DLBCL Treatment?

What Are the Goals of DLBCL Treatment? from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

A diffuse large B-cell lymphoma (DLBCL) treatment plan may have different goals depending on the patient. Expert Dr. Loretta Nastoupil provides an overview of factors that play into treatment decisions and shares information about current and emerging DLBCL treatments.

Dr. Loretta Nastoupil is Director of the Lymphoma Outcomes Database in the Department of Lymphoma/Myeloma at The University of Texas MD Anderson Cancer Center. Learn more about Dr. Nastoupil, here.

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Transcript:

Katherine:

Many factors come in to play when making a treatment decision, including a patient’s age and overall health. So, let’s walk through some of these considerations. Let’s start with treatment goals. What does this mean exactly? And what are the goals of treatment for DLBCL?

Dr. Nastoupil:

Great questions. For diffuse large B-cell lymphoma, my goal was that I want to eradicate this disease with one course of therapy. Now one course of therapy, again, may mean six cycles of treatment, or it may mean three to four plus/minus radiation. And that kind of gets back to the discussion we just had with stage. But the goal is to make it go away and never come back. Now, oncologists are eternal optimists.

And I saw this because we would not be oncologists if we weren’t always focused and hoping for the best outcomes for our patients.

Katherine:

Sure.

Dr. Nastoupil:

So, we, generally, when we’re counseling patients tend to keep the focus on what is the chance that I can cure this, and we use words like cure oftentimes. But there’s always those caveats. And those caveats are – we can’t really look into our crystal ball and predict the future for every given patient. So, we use tools to help us risk stratify patients, meaning if we took 100 people like a given person, we could predict the outcome for the majority of those patients.

So, with diffuse large B-cell lymphoma with no high-risk features – so, that gets back to the molecular subtype. Do they have double hit features – yes or no? The stage and something we call IPI, International Prognostic Index, that takes into account some clinical features. As you mentioned, patient specific factors, their age, their stage, some lab values, whether or not they have more than one extranodal variable. Then we can generally predict.

Again, if I have 100 patients with good risk IPI, 80 percent of them are likely to be cured and alive and well five to 10 years later. If I have someone with poor risk features that may not change exactly what I do for that patient, but that may help them and me in terms of should I be pursuing a trial to potentially have access to something that’s better than this standard option? Or how does this impact their planning?

Some people are close to retirement. Some people have specific life goals, such as a wedding or an anniversary that sometimes we use those sorts of calculators to best predict the future to inform some of that treatment. So, those are what we call sort of the characteristics coming into treatment.

There are comorbidities or sort of concomitant medical problems, such as heart disease, sometimes diabetes. But, generally, more often than not, it’s how healthy your heart is because my objective with treatment is to cure this.

Cure generally results from chemotherapy. And we can spend some time talking about why have we not moved away from chemotherapy in this disease? But, generally, that does involve chemo because that’s generally how I can eradicate this tumor.

But there are certain situations where that chemo may not be beneficial to a given a patient. It usually has to do with how healthy their heart function is at baseline. So, again, we look at all of these factors. What is their risk with the disease? What is their risk from the toxicity of treatment? And am I able to achieve that goal, which is to eradicate the disease?

Katherine:

Well, let’s talk about chemotherapy. Why is that still part of the regimen in a treatment plan?

Dr. Nastoupil:

Yes, I’m going to borrow an analogy that one of my colleagues Jason Westin uses all the time. The CHOP chemotherapy that is the backbone of our treatment for diffuse large B-cell lymphoma was developed in 1976.

There is no other technology that we would commonly use in our day to day. You wouldn’t still be driving your car you had in 1976. Clearly, our methods of communication in regards to phones have changed dramatically. So, why are we still using chemotherapy that was developed in 1976?

Katherine:

True.

Dr. Nastoupil:

Well, it’s not for lack of trying. Over the last four or five decades, we have been trying to improve upon this. And it works. It works for at least 60 percent of patients. When we tack on targeted therapy, such as immune

therapy where we use an antibody that will stick to the surface of a marker on that lymphoma cell and then use the immune system to do some of the heavy lifting, we can probably improve those cure rates from 60 percent to potentially as high as 80 percent. That’s really been the only substantial improvement we’ve made.

Now, there is one caveat. So, just recently, we heard a press release of the POLARIX study, which is the first trial in the last four decades that could potentially replace R-CHOP as the standard of care.

We don’t have the full results yet. It’s essentially utilizing a drug called polatuzumab, which is an antibody drug conjugate. It’s essentially chemo on a stick. But we’re delivering chemo specifically to (CD)79b, which is a target on B cell lymphomas and modifying the CHOPs. We’re not getting rid of chemo altogether. We’re dropping one of the chemotherapy agents and replacing it with this targeted agent. So, it’s essentially CHOP plus rituximab and polatuzumab might be the new standard.

But, again, that’s based off many, many efforts to try and replace CHOP. And we’re making slow incremental improvements, but we’re still keeping the therapies that tend to work.