Tag Archive for: radiation therapy

What Are the Stages of Follicular Lymphoma?

What Are the Stages of Follicular Lymphoma? from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

How does follicular lymphoma progress? Expert Dr. Tycel Phillips discusses the disease’s stages and the impact on treatment options.

Dr. Tycel Jovelle Phillips is a Medical Oncologist in the Hematology Clinic at The University of Michigan Rogel Cancer Center. Learn more about Dr. Phillips, here.

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Transcript:

Katherine:                  

You’ve touched upon this briefly, but what are the stages of follicular lymphoma? How does it progress?

Dr. Phillips:                 

So, when we talk about follicular lymphoma, so, in stages there are four stages. Stage one, which means it’s localized in one general area. Or potentially into one organ. Stage two means that it is on one side of the diaphragm. So, we use your diaphragm as sort of a dividing point. Sort of like a Mason-Dixon line of the body. So, if it’s all on one side, it’s a stage two. If you have disease both above and below the diaphragm, you’d be considered to be stage three. Stage four indicates that you either have an organ involved in a nonadjacent lymph node.

So, let’s just say there’s a spot in your liver and you have a lymph node in your neck, or if your bone marrow is involved. For the most part, most patients with follicular lymphoma, because again, when develops, it doesn’t really develop with symptoms and typically is in there for quite a bit of time. Most patients will have what we consider to be advanced stage of this disease, meaning it’s stage three or four. Because the cancer has quite a bit of time to grow and move around before we find it.

It also comes in a set of grades. So, stage and grades are different. Stage is location, grade is what the pathologist sort of looks at when he looks under a microscope – how angry or big the cells look. So, we typically divide it into grades one and two; it’s very hard to separate one and two, so it’s generally grouped together. Which means there are mostly small round cells and very few big cells. And then we have grade 3A and grade 3B. And grade 3A means that when they look at it under the microscope, they see a fair number of larger cells which means that’s probably a bit more aggressive than the grade one to two.

And grade 3B is sort of separated into a category of its own. And we tend to treat grade 3B as a more aggressive lymphoma. we treat that very closely, like we treat the diffuse large B-cell lymphomas. So, grade 3B is in a category of its own, and then grades one to two and grade three are sort of clumped together.

What Is Follicular Lymphoma?

What Is Follicular Lymphoma? from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

Dr. Tycel Phillips gives his expert definition of follicular lymphoma and explains why this disease is often found incidentally. 

Dr. Tycel Jovelle Phillips is a Medical Oncologist in the Hematology Clinic at The University of Michigan Rogel Cancer Center. Learn more about Dr. Phillips, here.

See More from The Pro-Active Follicular Lymphoma Patient Toolkit

Related Programs:

What are the stages of Follicular Lymphoma?

What Are the Stages of Follicular Lymphoma?

What Are the Treatment Goals for Follicular Lymphoma?

What Are the Treatment Goals for Follicular Lymphoma?

What Factors Are Considered When Choosing a Follicular Lymphoma Treatment?


Transcript:

Katherine:                  

What exactly is follicular lymphoma?

Dr. Phillips:                 

So, follicular lymphoma is a malignant growth or tumor in some situations, depending on how you want to describe it, of lymphocytes. Lymphocytes are normal cells that we have in our body and are a very important part of our immune system. For a very generic sort of description, lymphocytes come in what we call B and T-cells. B-cells, as I mentioned, are the cells that help make antibodies and it’s how we fight viruses and other diseases. These antibodies help our immune system recognize and hopefully clear these pathogens quicker.

And then we also have T-cells, which I like to refer to as like jailers, who will survey and sort of try to eliminate any abnormal cells. Lymphoma can come in a B-cell lymphoma or a T-cell lymphoma. For western Europe and the U.S., B-cell lymphomas account for the vast majority of cases of lymphoma; about 85%. When we look at B-cell lymphomas, we have Hodgkin’s Lymphomas, which are a separate category, and non-Hodgkin’s lymphomas.

And follicular lymphoma is the most common indolent, or what we consider slow growing, of non-Hodgkin’s lymphomas. So, when we talk about indolent as slow growing, these are lymphomas that are more than likely to be found incidentally by CAT scans. Or if you’re going for some other procedure, they’ll notice that you have enlarged lymph nodes and a biopsy will lead to a diagnosis of follicular lymphoma. In most cases, the cancer has probably been there for several years, at least months, before it’s been found. And in most cases, most patients have been living happily unbeknownst to them together with this cancer.

And so, follicular lymphoma being in that way is something that, again, we consider to be slow growing because, again, the more aggressive lymphomas tend to come with symptoms. So, these can come on more insidiously and are typically found incidentally.

Is the COVID Vaccine Safe and Effective for Follicular Lymphoma Patients?

Is the COVID Vaccine Safe and Effective for Follicular Lymphoma Patients? from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

Dr. Tycel Phillips discusses the efficacy and safety of the COVID vaccine for follicular lymphoma patients. Dr. Phillips reviews the effects it may have on patients and provides his expert advice.

Dr. Tycel Jovelle Phillips is a Medical Oncologist in the Hematology Clinic at The University of Michigan Rogel Cancer Center. Learn more about Dr. Phillips, here.

See More from The Pro-Active Follicular Lymphoma Patient Toolkit

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What Is the Patient’s Role in Follicular Lymphoma Decisions?


Transcript:

Katherine:                  

Is the COVID vaccine safe and effective for follicular lymphoma patients?

Dr. Phillips:                 

So, the vaccine is safe. The effectiveness of the vaccine does in some part depend on whether the patients are untreated or they’re currently on treatment. Some of the treatments that we use to combat follicular lymphoma and other lymphomas unfortunately targets one of the key cells in the response to the vaccine. So, as follicular lymphoma is a cancer of the malignant B-cell, one of our treatments are directed, you know, obviously killing off malignant B-cells. And unfortunately, we do take some innocent bystanders. So, your normal B-cells will be impacted, which does sometimes impact your abilities to make antibodies.

But we do know from research that the vaccines will also trigger a T-cell response, which most of our treatments will not impact. So, well, we do recommend for our patients to be vaccinated. Because, again, it is safe. And, again, it is effective even if it’s not as effective as it would be if you weren’t on treatment.

Katherine:                  

Mm-hmm. Better to be safe than sorry.

Dr. Phillips:                 

Yes.

Bladder Cancer Treatment Decisions: What’s Right for You?

Bladder Cancer Treatment Decisions: What’s Right for You? from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

Dr. Shilpa Gupta, a bladder cancer specialist, reviews the types of bladder cancer treatments available, key factors that affect treatment decisions, as well as emerging treatment and research in the field. Dr. Gupta also shares key advice and tips for partnering with your healthcare team.

Dr. Shilpa Gupta is the Director of the Genitourinary Medical Oncology at Taussig Cancer Institute and Co-Leader of the Genitourinary Oncology Program at Cleveland Clinic. Dr. Gupta’s research interests are novel drug development and understanding biomarkers of response and resistance to therapies in bladder cancer. Learn more about Dr. Gupta, here.

Download Program Guide

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Transcript:

Katherine Banwell:    

Hello and welcome. I’m Katherine Banwell, your host for today’s program. In this webinar we’re going to help you learn more about bladder cancer, what it is, how it’s treated, and we’ll share tools to help you work with your healthcare team to access the best care.

Before we get into the discussion, please remember that this program is not a substitute for seeking medical advice. Please refer to your healthcare team about what might be best for you.

Joining us today is Dr. Shilpa Gupta. Dr. Gupta, welcome and would you please introduce yourself?

Dr. Shilpa Gupta:       

Thank you, Katherine. I’m really delighted to be on this program. I’m a genitourinary medical oncologist and the leader for the Genitourinary Oncology Program at the Cleveland Clinic in Cleveland, Ohio. My research focuses on bladder cancer, and I treat a lot of patients in clinic with various stages of bladder cancer. Glad to be here.

Katherine:                  

Thank you so much for taking time out of your busy schedule today to be with us. Before we learn more about bladder cancer, I’d like you to answer a question that’s on the minds of many patients. Is the COVID vaccine safe and effective for bladder cancer patients?

Dr. Gupta:                  

Absolutely, 100 percent. In fact, we highly recommend our bladder cancer patients and patients with other cancers to get the COVID vaccine because the severity of getting COVID is much more profound in patients who have cancer and are immunocompromised in general.

And the vaccine is safe no matter what kind of treatment patients are on or what stage of disease they have.

Katherine:                  

Okay. Let’s start with a basic definition Dr. Gupta. What is bladder cancer?

Dr. Gupta:                  

Bladder cancer, basically as the name implies, is a cancer which affects the urinary bladder but, it’s not just limited to the bladder. It can be in the urothelial lining which extends up to the pelvis of the kidney. That’s not kidney cancer but still it’s thought of – urothelial cancer. So, I would define it as – because the treatment systemically is quite similar. So, when the urothelial cancer can be originating from bladder, per se, or from the upper tract disease, like the renal pelvis and the ureter. So, that’s the basic definition of this cancer.

Katherine:                  

Are there bladder cancer subtypes? And if so, what are they?

Dr. Gupta:                  

Yes, there are different kinds of bladder cancer and the most common one is urothelial carcinoma transitional cell carcinoma or TCC. This is the most common and there can be other types known as variant histology.

Sometimes they can be pure squamous cell carcinoma, which is only 1 to 2 percent of all bladder cancer. It’s very rare, but it does look like flat cells that are found on the surface of the skin.  That’s why it’s easily identifiable and the treatment is slightly different.

Adenocarcinoma is another subtype where it’s only one percent of bladder cancers as well. Small cell cancers and sarcomatoid type are other very rare variants. But, I would say that for the most part when we call something urothelial carcinoma, we are defaulting to the common type called transitional cell carcinoma.

Katherine:                  

What are the stages of bladder cancer, and how does it progress?

Dr. Gupta:                  

The stages of bladder cancer, like many other diseases, is stage I, stage II, stage III, and stage IV. Many times, we hear about – that patients have superficial bladder cancer, and many times we hear that it’s stage IV or advanced.

Basically, whenever the bladder cancer is only involving the superficial layers because the bladder is a very muscular organ, so when it is involving the superficial epithelium or the lamina propria that is stage I. Anytime it involves the muscle it is called stage II and that has more serious consequences and that usually requires that radical cystectomy or bladder may come out, or patients get radiation with chemotherapy because chances of recurring are much higher with that.

Anytime it is going a little bit beyond the bladder, still contained, it’s stage III and when it involves the other organs in the pelvic region then we call it stage IV. Or, if it has gone beyond the pelvis to distant sites, like lung, or liver, or bones. That is the definition for metastatic cancer.

Katherine:                  

Thank you. That’s very helpful to know. Now that we know more about bladder cancer and how it’s staged, let’s move on to treatment. What are the goals of treatment for bladder cancer?

Dr. Gupta:                  

The goals of treatment depend on what stage the disease is in. For patients who have non-muscle invasive cancer, we use the oldest immunotherapy that is out there called BCG.

The goal is to prevent recurrence and prevent progression to muscle invasion. Many times, despite treatment that may not happen and that’s when patients need their bladder out. I would say that the goal for treatment for localized disease is to cure the disease and prevent distant recurrences and prolong survival. The goals of treatment with metastatic disease are to improve survival and delay progression-free survival, improve response rates.

Katherine:                  

What do you feel is the patient’s role in treatment decisions?                            

Dr. Gupta:                  

I think patients are the key we center everything around for treatments, right? There are so many treatment options and it’s really very difficult to make a decision without getting the patient’s perspective.

What are the patient’s goals from their lives and what they see the cancer as? For example, if somebody has muscle-invasive disease and the cancer is not very big and the patient has the option of getting the bladder removed which means they will have a stoma for the rest of their lives, or they can reclaim their bladder after undergoing radiation and chemotherapy and still undergo cystoscopies, or looking inside the bladder, every three months.

Some patients just don’t want a stoma no matter what, so we try to tailor the therapies according to that and a lot, many times, patients – these are older patients, they may have a lot of comorbidities, they may not be the most fit patients to undergo a big procedure, so we have to tailor it according to the patient. I think the patient’s role is what we all strive to go by.

What is a good treatment for one patient may not be a good treatment for another patient.

Katherine:                  

True. You’ve touched upon treatment options but let’s walk through the treatment approaches for bladder cancer and who they might be right for, and I’d like to start with surgery. Who would be a good candidate for surgery?

Dr. Gupta:                  

I think patients who are otherwise fit, that is, they have good performance status, don’t have a lot of cardiac or other comorbidities, are not very obese, and of course have to be fit for any major procedure are usually considered good surgical candidates. But, as far as – In terms of staging, the patients with stage I, if BCG does not work in them or immunotherapy doesn’t work, they are recommended surgery if they are good candidates.

If they are not good candidates, we then – our role as medical oncologists is to offer other systemic therapies. As far as stage II cancer is concerned, the gold standard has been chemotherapy, followed by surgery but that’s the gold standard.

It may not apply for every patient. Depending on how fit patients are. Are they – we don’t usually just go by their chronological age but how fit they are? What are their comorbidities? If surgery is going to be a big burden for them moving forward, then we do talk about radiation and chemotherapy and other bladder preservation approaches.

Katherine:                  

What about immunotherapy and targeted therapies? Who would you use those on?

Dr. Gupta:                  

Well, since the advent of immunotherapies back in 2016 they’ve really – we’ve made a lot of progress and changed the way treat bladder cancer and the overall survival has improved by leaps and bounds with all these drugs.

Immunotherapy now plays a role in different stages. It is approved for superficial or non-muscle invasive bladder cancer if, let’s say, BCG doesn’t work. In muscle invasive disease we have along with others shown that immunotherapy is safe and effective, although it is not yet FDA approved, so there is a lot of clinical trials going on to prove its superiority in combination and by itself.                                   

And, in metastatic disease or locally advanced disease immunotherapy plays a huge role for patients who have either disease recurrence after chemotherapy or are not good candidates for any chemotherapy.

I would say that immunotherapy is a very big – plays a very big role in the treatment. Unfortunately, not everybody responds to immunotherapy only about 20 to 25 percent of patients do.

 That’s why we have these other novel therapies that have been coming through, like antibody drug conjugates, namely enfortumab vedotin, sacituzumab govitecan, and targeted therapy in the form of an FGFR inhibitor was the first targeted therapy that was approved a couple of years ago for patients who have a mutation in their tumors.

That’s really personalized medicine for those patients.

Katherine:                  

Right. What about biomarker testing? Does the presence of certain biomarkers impact certain treatment options?

Dr. Gupta:                  

That’s a great question and we’re all striving to find the perfect biomarker in bladder cancer. In the past we thought that expression of PD-L1 in the tumor cells and immune cells is a marker of how well the immunotherapy will work, but we have learned over the past couple of years that biomarker has turned out to be quite useless.

We don’t really need that to guide our treatment. We’re still depending on clinical biomarkers for immunotherapy use or chemotherapy use. I would say that the biomarker question is still being looked at and eventually I would say it’s not going to be one biomarker, but a composite of several different biomarkers that we will be able to use comprehensively.

Katherine:                  

Where do clinical trials fit into the treatment plan?

Dr. Gupta:                  

I think the clinical trials fit at every stage in bladder cancer for a patient’s treatment plan.

Whenever possible we should strive to offer trials and make it easier for patients to enroll in trials because that is the way to advance the field and offer patients options which they may not otherwise get as standard of care.

Katherine:                  

Right. If a patient isn’t feeling confident with their treatment plan or their care, should they consider a second opinion or consulting a specialist?

Dr. Gupta:                  

Absolutely. I think every patient has a right to consult a second opinion or get second opinions, or even more opinions if they want to make the right decision. Many times, patients are told about one treatment option, and then they want to know, “Well, what alternative options do I have?” “What if I really don’t want my bladder out?” “Is there anything else that can be done?” So, they should be seeing a radiation oncologist in that case.

I think the way we can really make a difference and offer multidisciplinary care is to have the patient see a surgeon, a radiation oncologist, and a medical oncologist. That’s true multidisciplinary care for anybody with localized disease. For metastatic disease, we have a lot of options and usually medical oncologists are the ones who manage it.

Patients can always get second opinions if they feel they want to do something less or more aggressive.

Katherine:                  

What advice to have for patients who may be nervous about offending their current doctor by getting a second opinion?

Dr. Gupta:                   

That’s a great question Katherine, and I know a lot of patients feel that their doctors may feel offended, but in my experience when – if my patients are not local or they – I actually encourage them to go get second opinions and even make referrals to places which may have trials if we don’t have that. It’s always good to have the patients be able to decide and I don’t think nowadays doctors take offense if patients want to get another opinion. In fact, we try to collaborate with our community oncologists.

Where, let’s say patients are currently being treated and they come to us to discuss trials or just to discuss if they’re on the right track. We reassure them and reach out to the community doctors that – yes, we totally agree with what the patient is doing, and these are some other options down the line. And, with the advent of virtual health it’s really become a lot more collaborative because patients are still getting treated locally. When the have their scans and have questions they can schedule a virtual appointment with their doctors in institutions where we have more treatment options like trials.

Katherine:                  

I imagine side effects vary among patients. What side effects should someone undergoing treatment be aware of?

Dr. Gupta:                  

Yeah, and that also depends on what kind of treatment they’re getting, Katherine. So, if somebody’s getting chemotherapy, some of the usual chemotherapy related side effects.

Again, it depends on what chemotherapy they are getting, but usually it’s nausea, vomiting, peripheral neuropathy, hair loss, low count, so we try to prevent their counts from going down to prevent infection. If they’re undergoing a local therapy like BCG, they may get irritation in the bladder, something called urinary tract infections can happen, or just an inflammatory state.

Immunotherapy is not as hard as chemotherapy, any day it’s easier but it can cause some rare and infrequent side effects because the immune system can turn against other organs which can sometimes be life threatening or fatal. That could be inflammation of the lung, of the colon, of the different organs in the brain, of the thyroid gland, of muscles, of heart. It can be pretty much anything. We educate the patients accordingly for that.

And, as far as the newer antibody drug conjugates are concerned, they can cause neuropathy or low counts, hair loss. So, every treatment depending on what treatment we’re choosing has a different treatment side – related toxicity profile and we go about reducing or modifying doses as we go along treating the patient.

Katherine:                  

Right. How is treatment effectiveness monitored?

Dr. Gupta:                  

The way we monitor treatment effectiveness is monitoring the patients clinically. If they are getting better, then you know that – even without a scan you know patients are actually going to be responding. I’ve personally seen patients who, right after one or two cycles of some novel therapies like antibody drug conjugates or immunotherapy just, turn around.

They’re gaining weight, eating better, so you know that person is doing well. Ultimately, every patient does need serial imaging, like CAT scans, or MRIs, or bone scans to document how the cancer is responding or not responding.

Katherine:                  

Right. We received this question from an audience member prior to the program. Eileen asks, “I’m worried about a recurrence. Is there something I can do to lower my risk of the cancer coming back?”

Dr. Gupta:                  

So, if patients have been treated for a localized disease in a curative setting, the bigger – the number one thing we tell patients if they are heavy smokers is to try to quit or cut down because that remains an ongoing risk factor. Other than that, I think if patients are exposed to some environmental agents which can cause bladder cancer that is in their control. Other than that, really one has to undergo surveillance with the procedures like cystoscopy or scans to see how they’re doing.

I think the things under control are really smoking. Big one.       

Katherine:                  

That’s the big one. Thank you for explaining that. And to our audience, please continue to send in your questions to question@powerfulpatients.org. We’ll work to get them answered on future programs.

So, Dr. Gupta, are there emerging approaches for treating bladder cancer that patients should know about?

Dr. Gupta:                  

Yes, absolutely. I would say that the field is so rife with so many different treatment approaches and ways to offer more personalized medicine. We know, for example chemotherapy followed by surgery has been the gold standard, but we have seen data that there are certain genes in some patients’ tumors which may predict how well they will respond and potentially we could avoid a life-changing surgery like cystectomy.

And we have trials with immunotherapy adding to chemotherapy in bladder preservation approaches along with radiation. So, these are some of the new work that’s been done. Approaches to intensify the effect of BCG in newly diagnosed non-muscle invasive bladder cancer patients are also ongoing. Then, in the metastatic setting, we have so many treatment options that have become approved in the last couple of years, now the goal is, well, how to sequence the therapies best for the patient and whether in the front-line therapy we can actually get rid of chemotherapy.

Some of these antibody drug conjugates and immunotherapy combinations are proving to be very effective and the hope is that one day patients may not need chemotherapy because we have chemo-sparing regimens. So, there’s a lot going on and I think the progress has been tremendous in the past few years.                                            

Katherine:                  

Some patients may be fearful when it comes to clinical trials. So, what would you say to someone who might be hesitant to consider participating in one? 

Dr. Gupta:                  

I would say there’s a lot of misconceptions out there that going on a trial is like being a guinea pig or you get a placebo. For the most part, patients are getting active drugs whenever possible. The only time where we have placebo-controlled trials is if, for that particular setting, there is no approved treatment. But I think patients should get all the information from their doctors and the study teams about the pros and cons.

Many times, it’s about – you could do the study because the patients meet the criteria and are fit to do it and if they wait for later, they may not be eligible anymore for whatever reasons.

I always put it this way, that standard of care therapies will still be available, but studies are sometimes with a tight window and tight criteria. So, I think patients should know that all these studies that are out there are very ethical and use the best possible control arm. So that even if they don’t get that experimental drug, they still get what is the standard of care unless it is something really being compared to nothing.    

Katherine:                  

Right. Let’s talk about patient self-advocacy for a moment. Patients can sometimes feel like they’re bothering their healthcare team with their comments and their questions. Why is it important for patients to speak up when it comes to symptoms and side effects?

Dr. Gupta:                  

Yeah, I think the patients have to be their own advocates, right? Unless they do tell their team about what they are going through, many times action will not be taken unless they’re actually seeing their team in real-time.

And sometimes that visit may not be happening for months so it’s very important to never feel that you’re bothering the teams. And nowadays, with all these electronic ways where patients can communicate with their teams, I think patients are very aware that they can send a MyChart message, for example, and someone will get back to them within a day. So, I think that is really important and the way they can communicate with their teams has also evolved.

Katherine:                  

How do you think patients can feel confident in speaking up and becoming a partner in their own care?

Dr. Gupta:                  

I think they have to tell their doctors during their visit that they would like to – whatever their expectations are and what they would like their teams to do to fulfill those expectations.

I think that’s the best way I can say this. That they should always speak up no matter what and if they feel that they’re concerns about treatment are not being heard, then they should let their treatment teams know and ask what alternative treatments there may be. Or, if their life goals have changed, sometimes patients want to get aggressive treatment and sometimes they just don’t want to go through it anymore. They should let their teams know so, adequately; the goals of care can be modified.

Katherine:                  

You’ve spoken about a multidisciplinary care team for bladder cancer patients. Who are the members of that team?

Dr. Gupta:                  

So, the multidisciplinary care team are all the key players who participate in patient’s care.

The urologist who, for the most part, diagnoses patients. Because patients are, let’s say, having blood in the urine, they see a urologist, bladder mass.

Then it’s the medical oncologist like us who are kind of the neutral folks where even if the patient is undergoing surgery, we offer some treatment. If a patient is undergoing radiation, we offer some treatment. If a patient is metastatic disease, then sometimes, they just see us, unless they have some complications or if they have a new spot in the bone where we want them to get radiated then we include that.

Then there’s the radiation oncologist, whose role comes for patients with localized disease. So that a patient, when they are diagnosed with bladder cancer and have localized disease, they should know all their options. That surgery is one option. 

Radiation can be another option, and they have options to preserve their bladder too. I think that’s what a multidisciplinary clinic comprises.

Katherine:                  

Right. So, patients with children and grandchildren who may be wondering, is bladder cancer hereditary?

Dr. Gupta:                  

For the most part it may play some role, but I think for the most part it the environmental factors, and smoking, and exposure to environmental carcinogens. So, it typically doesn’t pass from somebody to their next of kin. But if somebody’s very young and getting cancer, it’s always a good idea to include genetic counseling so that members of the family can be screened for it.

Katherine:                  

Dr. Gupta, if patients want to learn more about bladder cancer, or if their families want to learn more what are some credible resources that you would send people to?

Dr. Gupta:                  

Yeah, I think it’s always good to get credible information than just googling things which may or may not be true. Bcan.org is a very powerful resource that is a bladder cancer advocacy network and as the name implies it’s for the patients, made by bladder cancer advocates.

That’s one of the resources that we highly recommend. Then there’s the resource that you all are working on. So, I think these collectively are the best sources of information which patients should try to stick to.

Katherine:                  

Right. That’s good advice. To close, what would you like to leave our audience with? What are you hopeful about?

Dr. Gupta:                  

I think I would like to say that there’s a lot of good information, there’s a lot of advocacy resources. Patients should try to get their information from these verified sources and bring it to their care teams. And never hesitate to reach out for whatever they need during their diagnosis and treatment phase. Always ask questions. Ask about clinical trials. Ask about alternative options. That’s what I would leave the message to be.

Katherine:                  

Thank you so much for joining us today, Dr. Gupta. We really appreciate it.

Dr. Gupta:                  

Thank you, Katherine.

Katherine:                  

And thank you to all of our partners. To learn more about bladder cancer and to help you access tools to help you become a more proactive patient visit powerfulpatients.org. I’m Katherine Banwell. Thanks for joining us today.

Follicular Lymphoma Treatment Decisions: What’s Right for You?

Follicular Lymphoma Treatment Decisions: What’s Right for You? from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

When considering therapy for follicular lymphoma, what determines the best treatment for YOU? Dr. Tycel Phillips reviews key factors for making treatment decisions, tips for partnering with your healthcare team, and shares an update on emerging treatment and research.

Dr. Tycel Jovelle Phillips is a Medical Oncologist in the Hematology Clinic at The University of Michigan Rogel Cancer Center.

See More from The Pro-Active Follicular Lymphoma Patient Toolkit

Download Guide

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Transcript:

Katherine:             

Hello and welcome. I’m Katherine Banwell, your host for today’s webinar. In this program, we’re going to learn more about follicular lymphoma. What it is, how it’s treated, and we’ll share tools to help you work with your healthcare team to access the best care. Before we meet our guest, let’s review a few important details. The reminder email you received about this program contains a link to program materials.

If you haven’t already, click that link to access information to follow along during the webinar. At the end of this program, you’ll receive a link to a program survey. Please take a moment to provide feedback about your experience today in order to help us plan future webinars. And finally, before we get into the discussion, please remember that this program is not a substitute for seeking medical advice. Please refer to your healthcare team about what might be best for you. Joining me today is Dr. Tycel Phillips. Welcome, Dr. Phillips. Would you please introduce yourself?

Dr. Phillips:                 

Hi, I’m Dr. Tycel Phillips. I’m an associate professor at the University of Michigan. I look forward to talking today.

Katherine:                  

Good. Thank you so much for taking the time out of your schedule. Before we learn about follicular lymphoma, let’s start with a question we’ve received that’s on the minds of many patients. Is the COVID vaccine safe and effective for follicular lymphoma patients?

Dr. Phillips:                 

So, the vaccine is safe. The effectiveness of the vaccine does in some part depend on whether the patients are untreated or they’re currently on treatment. Some of the treatments that we use to combat follicular lymphoma and other lymphomas unfortunately targets one of the key cells in the response to the vaccine. So, as follicular lymphoma is a cancer of the malignant B-cell, one of our treatments are directed, you know, obviously killing off malignant B-cells. And unfortunately, we do take some innocent bystanders. So, your normal B-cells will be impacted, which does sometimes impact your abilities to make antibodies.

But we do know from research that the vaccines will also trigger a T-cell response, which most of our treatments will not impact. So, well, we do recommend for our patients to be vaccinated. Because, again, it is safe. And, again, it is effective even if it’s not as effective as it would be if you weren’t on treatment.

Katherine:                  

Mm-hmm. Better to be safe than sorry.

Dr. Phillips:                 

Yes.

Katherine:                  

Let’s start at the very beginning. What exactly is follicular lymphoma?

Dr. Phillips:                 

So, follicular lymphoma is a malignant growth or tumor in some situations, depending on how you want to describe it, of lymphocytes. Lymphocytes are normal cells that we have in our body and are a very important part of our immune system. For a very generic sort of description, lymphocytes come in what we call B and T cells. B cells, as I mentioned, are the cells that help make antibodies and it’s how we fight viruses and other diseases. These antibodies help our immune system recognize and hopefully clear these pathogens quicker.

And then we also have T cells, which I like to refer to as like jailers, who will survey and sort of try to eliminate any abnormal cells. Lymphoma can come in a B-cell lymphoma or a T-cell lymphoma. For western Europe and the U.S., B-cell lymphomas account for the vast majority of cases of lymphoma; about 85 percent. When we look at B-cell lymphomas, we have Hodgkin’s Lymphomas, which are a separate category, and non-Hodgkin’s lymphomas.

And follicular lymphoma is the most common indolent, or what we consider slow growing, of non-Hodgkin’s lymphomas. So, when we talk about indolent as slow growing, these are lymphomas that are more than likely to be found incidentally by CAT scans. Or if you’re going for some other procedure, they’ll notice that you have enlarged lymph nodes and a biopsy will lead to a diagnosis of follicular lymphoma. In most cases, the cancer has probably been there for several years, at least months, before it’s been found. And in most cases, most patients have been living happily unbeknownst to them together with this cancer.

And so, follicular lymphoma being in that way is something that, again, we consider to be slow growing because, again, the more aggressive lymphomas tend to come with symptoms. So, these can come on more insidiously and are typically found incidentally.

Katherine:                  

You’ve touched upon this briefly, but what are the stages of follicular lymphoma? How does it progress?

Dr. Phillips:                 

So, when we talk about follicular lymphoma, so, in stages there are four stages. Stage I, which means it’s localized in one general area. Or potentially into one organ. Stage II means that it is on one side of the diaphragm. So, we use your diaphragm as sort of a dividing point. Sort of like a Mason-Dixon line of the body. So, if it’s all on one side, it’s a stage II. If you have disease both above and below the diaphragm, you’d be considered to be stage III. Stage IV indicates that you either have an organ involved in a nonadjacent lymph node.

So, let’s just say there’s a spot in your liver and you have a lymph node in your neck, or if your bone marrow is involved. For the most part, most patients with follicular lymphoma, because again, when develops, it doesn’t really develop with symptoms and typically is in there for quite a bit of time. Most patients will have what we consider to be advanced stage of this disease, meaning it’s stage III or IV. Because the cancer has quite a bit of time to grow and move around before we find it.

It also comes in a set of grades. So, stage and grades are different. Stage is location, grade is what the pathologist sort of looks at when he looks under a microscope – how angry or big the cells look. So, we typically divide it into grades 1 and 2; it’s very hard to separate one and two, so it’s generally grouped together. Which means there are mostly small round cells and very few big cells. And then we have grade 3A and grade 3B. And grade 3A means that when they look at it under the microscope, they see a fair number of larger cells which means that’s probably a bit more aggressive than the grade 1 to 2.

And grade 3B is sort of separated into a category of its own. And we tend to treat grade 3B as a more aggressive lymphoma. we treat that very closely, like we treat the diffuse large B-cell lymphomas. So, grade 3B is in a category of its own, and then grades 1 to 2 and grade 3 are sort of clumped together.

Katherine:                  

Okay. That’s very helpful, thank you. Now that we know more about follicular lymphoma and how it’s staged, let’s move on to treatment approaches. Many factors come into play, right, when making a treatment decision. Including a patient’s age and overall health. So, let’s walk through these considerations. How about we begin with treatment goals? What does this mean exactly and what are the goals of treatment for follicular lymphoma?

Dr. Phillips:                 

So, for the vast majority of patients, follicular lymphoma unfortunately to date is not curable. So, for those patients the goal of treatment when we initiate treatment is to alleviate any symptoms that may be caused by the lymphoma.

So, the patient has fevers, they have night sweats, or there’s some sort of organ damage from the cancer, our goal of treatment is to reverse that and put the cancer into what we call a remission. Remission basically means that from the test that we have currently, we cannot find any evidence of the cancer. That does not mean that you’re cured from the cancer. Patients with earlier stages – so, if you have a patient with stage I or a localized stage II, we approach that with a little bit of a different treatment mindset.

So, if we can catch it early enough, which is very hard given because of the cancer. So, these are really incidentally found, and in some cases, by luck. We can potentially cure follicular lymphoma in these patients. But that’s more of a curative intent with radiation and not systemic therapy. With the advent of PET scans, which have made it a little bit easier to find all the hidden areas of where the follicular lymphoma may hide out, concurrently with a bone marrow biopsy, if a patient is truly stage I, we will initiate therapy with a curative intent.

Whereas, again, with the other patients, our goal is just to control the symptoms and put you into remission.

Katherine:                  

What is considered when choosing a treatment? Are there test results that can impact the options?

Dr. Phillips:                 

So, there are. So, for the most part we’ll take a couple of things into consideration. So, there is no standard of care for follicular lymphomas. So, there are a couple different options that can be utilized in the upfront setting for the untreated patient. So, comorbidities play a part in what sort of treatment we choose. Patient’s age and fitness will play a part. If there’s any heart disease, that will play a part in the situation as well. And also, as I said, stage will play a part in sort of what our treatment goals are.

So, if our treatment goal for a really unfit patient who we don’t think can tolerate chemotherapy, it’s just symptom control. And they don’t have a lot of disease, we can sometimes treat them with just a monoclonal antibody we call rituximab (Rituxan) as a single agent.

If the patient has a lot of disease, and they are a fit patient, we will tend to combine rituximab with several different chemotherapy regimens. Because rituximab plus chemotherapy works better than chemotherapy and also rituximab alone, especially depending on the amount of the disease that we’re trying to treat. And again, as I mentioned before, if it’s a localized patient there is known to be radiation plus or minus rituximab in that situation.

But because of some of the side effects of the drugs we use, and obviously now we’re in a pandemic, a lot of those will take sort of some of the consideration of what we use. Some of the drugs that we use are either more sort of immunosuppressants than others, and obviously being in a pandemic, we have to take that into consideration because we’re not treating to cure. Some of the drugs can cause heart damage, some of the drugs can damage nerves, some of the drugs include steroids, which might be prohibited with some patients. So, all that sometimes has to be taken into consideration when we choose our regimen.

Katherine:                  

Yeah. It sounds like there are a lot of factors coming into play here.

Dr. Phillips:                 

Yeah, I mean normally, without a pandemic there’s a lot of factors, and the pandemic just makes things a little bit harder. Just because, again, our patients are already at risk based with some of the treatments we choose.

Katherine:                  

Yeah. Yeah. It’s pretty challenging right now. Does treatment typically start right away?

Dr. Phillips:                 

So, that really depends on a stage and also whether we meet certain sort of criteria to treat. So, we don’t have to treat right away. So, if a patient has a disease, and the disease is not in an area where we think it’s curative, for the most part we can enter into what we call a watch and wait. Meaning we will observe a patient very closely and defer treatment until the patient develops symptoms or other indications that warrant treatment.

We do know that there is no impact on longevity by sort of partaking in this approach. So, you won’t live any longer or you won’t live any shorter if we watch and wait versus initiating therapy right away. It just saves you from having some of the toxicities from treatment without any real major benefits.

So, remember the goal for most patients with follicular lymphoma is to alleviate symptoms or problems. If you don’t have a symptom or a problem, me giving you treatment is not going to make you feel any better. Actually, it would probably make you feel a little bit worse. To get you back to where you were when you started.                    

Katherine:                  

Yeah, right. What do you feel is the patient’s role in treatment decisions?

Dr. Phillips:                 

So, I know historically a lot of times, you come into an office, and we tell you what you’re going to get and what you’re not going to get. Patients nowadays are I would say a lot more savvy as far as what drugs are out there. And there are a lot more sort of conversational groups on social media between patients who’ve had treatment before and newly diagnosed patients. So, patients come in with a lot more information than they had historically had before. So, in that point, I think it’s more of an open dialogue about what options we have, what options are best for you, and what our treatment goals are at that point.

But all it means, given that we don’t yet have a standard of care, it leaves it open for discussion about sort of which route we choose to try to get your cancer under control.

Katherine:                  

Mm-hmm. Dr. Phillips, if a patient isn’t feeling confident with their treatment plan or their care, do you think they should consider a second opinion or a consult with a specialist?

Dr. Phillips:                 

I think a second opinion is probably best for all patients. It’s always probably good to get a different opinion about how the disease will be treated. So, I do encourage all my patients, even here, to get a second opinion. Some take me up on it, others won’t. But the option is always there to get a second opinion, just to see if anybody would do things any differently.

And I would say for the most part, most people would tend to treat the same way. Very seldom do we have differences in what our treatment recommendations would be. I think the biggest difference in some situations, it’s really about some patients are very uncomfortable being watched with an active cancer. And so, in that situation, that’s probably the biggest discrepancy we have nowadays.

Because of the anxiety of the watch and wait approach. Some patients would like treatment right away, irrespective of whether they need it or not. So, you’ll sometimes get discrepancies with our patients about that.

Katherine:                  

Mm-hmm. What would you say to a patient who may be nervous about offending their current doctor by getting a second opinion?

Dr. Phillips:                 

You shouldn’t be. If your doctor is offended because you’re getting a second opinion, that’s probably not the doctor for you. Yeah, I think that at this point, any physician that’s confident in their decision they’re giving you should not be offended if you go seek reassurance from somebody else.

Katherine:                  

Yeah, good advice. Thank you. Now that we’ve discussed factors that can impact treatment decisions, would you walk us through the currently available follicular lymphoma treatment approaches? And who they might be right for?

Dr. Phillips:                 

Sure. So, we’ll start with the newly diagnosed or untreated patient. So, again, if you’re newly diagnosed or untreated, your options are the monoclonal antibody, Rituximab. Again, that’s a CD20 monoclonal antibody.

That is typically given once weekly for four weeks and can be repeated, if need be, after a break. And that’s usually reserved for patients who have minimal symptoms, low burden disease. Because, again, data has shown that the bulkier the disease, you’re likely not to have a very durable or deep response with just simulating Rituximab. Additional options include Rituximab plus chemotherapy.

So, we have regimens such as CDP, which is Cytoxan, vincristine, and prednisone. Cytoxan and vincristine being a steroid, prednisone being — sorry, Cytoxan and vincristine being a chemotherapy agent, and prednisone being a steroid. We have our bendamustine, bendamustine being a chemotherapy agent. There’s R-CHOP, which is Cytoxan, vincristine, Adriamycin, and prednisone. And sometimes that is reserved, because unlike the other two, R-CHOP can only be given once because of the accumulation of the anthracycline.

You can only have so much of that in a lifetime before you run a risk of cardiac toxicity.

Katherine:                  

Oh.

Dr. Phillips:                 

And also, R-CHOP as of right now is a standard of care for diffuse large B-cell lymphoma. Which every patient with follicular lymphoma has a chance of transforming into diffuse large B-cell lymphoma at some point. So, we tend to try to reserve R-CHOP if we can. Additionally, more recently, there was a study called Relevance, which evaluated RPMO versus an agent called lenalidomide plus Rituximab, what we call R squared.

So, it was designed as a superiority study, but what came out of it is R squared is probably equivalent, not better, than R chemo. So that is also an option up front. With lenalidomide it’s a little bit different than the other agents, which all give it intravenously, meaning through the vein. But lenalidomide is an oral medication, that you would take 21 days on, and seven days off. And that’s given in conjunction with the Rituximab. And you typically would take that for 12 cycles, or about a year of treatment.

Whereas the chemotherapy regimens that I mentioned before, are typically given for six cycles. Meaning you’ll be taking it for a duration of 18 weeks or 24 weeks. So around four and half to six months for the chemotherapy. Thereafter, it’s a bit controversial, but some patients can then transition to what we call Rituximab maintenance.

Where you would get Rituximab every other month for a period of two to three years. Typically, two years, as a way to delay the return of the cancer. So, R maintenance we know of improves your progression of survival, so the time until the cancer comes back. And there is no survival benefit with maintenance at this point. So, it is in some ways a bit controversial. Especially now, given the pandemic.

Katherine:                  

What about stem cell transplant? Is that an option?

Dr. Phillips:                 

So, for up front, that’s usually not something that we typically do. So, for stem cell transplantation, there are two types of stem cell transplantation. There’s one called an Autologous Stem Cell Transplantation, which is basically really a stem cell rescue.

You get a high dose of chemotherapy after stem cells are collected from you and those stem cells are given back to rescue your body from the chemo. That is typically reserved for what we call high risk patients. So, we give you an initial up front chemotherapy regimen. And if your cancer comes back within less than 24 months of completion of that therapy, you fall into what we call a POD24 category. Which means Progression of Disease within 24 months.

We do know those patients are at higher risk, than patients who stay in remission for at least 24 months or longer. So, if we look at overall survival for those POD24 patients, about half of those patients will succumb to their disease within a five-year period. Which is much different for what we see with the standard for follicular lymphoma patients. So, and that POD24 category it does appear that Autologous Stem Cell Transplantation is beneficial in that patient population. As well as an Allogenic Stem Cell Transplant. So, an allogenic transplant is when you get immune cells from another donor.

So, “allo” meaning from a different person. So, in that sense, you get sort of temporized, and they would give you donor lymphocytes. And those lymphocytes themselves would try to fight off your cancer. So, an Auto transplant is mainly just chemo; an Allo transplant, the donor cells help fight off the cancer.

Katherine:                  

Right.

Dr. Phillips:                 

There are complications to both, which is why they’re not typically given up front. The Allo transplant probably has more risk of complications as well. Those cells can also recognize your body as being foreign and try to fight them off because they don’t originate from you. And there’s also just a risk of other death from that procedure. So, all those have to be taken with a bit of caution. And for the Allo transplant, it’s generally only recommended if you have that, a sibling donor. Because there’s much less risk of complications than versus you get an unrelated donor.

Katherine:                  

Right. Right, that makes sense. If someone receives treatment and then goes into remission, how are they monitored?

Dr. Phillips:                 

So, there’s a couple of different ways you can go about it.

Historically, what we would do is we would actually sometimes get CAT scans. But we’ve sort of pulled back from that in recent years. So, as of right now, the recommendation is really just clinical observation, meaning what I call well baby visits. Meaning I will see you in clinic at least every three months for the first year after completion of therapy. We do a system assessment, we’ll do a physical exam, we’ll do labs. Unless there is really something that at the completion of therapy that I’m concerned about, we won’t typically do any imaging.

We reserve imaging until there is a concern at some point, whether you have symptoms, there’s a lab issue, or there’s some other finding that comes up that means that we have to repeat pictures. So those visits I’ll do typically every three months for the first year, spaced out that every four months for the second year, post treatment. And then every six months up until about year four. And then it’ll become a yearly visit thereafter, as long as you continue to remain well without symptoms and nothing on an exam that’s concerning.

Katherine:                  

Yeah. We received this question from an audience member prior to the program. Angela asks, “What if I relapse after treatment? What are my options then?”

Dr. Phillips:                 

So, a lot of that, again, depends on the timing. If you relapse early, obviously whatever we gave you in the frontline we would not repeat. And again, if it’s within the 24-month period, again, that takes you on the road of POD24. Wherein patients who are fit enough, it would take you to a route where you would actually probably get a transplant. It’s consolidation to extend our true progression sabbatical.

If you relapse after 24 months, that would really depend on what you received in the frontline because some of these agents can be repeated. If we don’t repeat what you’ve had in a frontline setting – so again, if you’ve got R chemo, then a second line setting, normally what we would do now, based on published data from the augment study, is we would typically treat these patients with Rituximab and lenalidomide, which is that oral medication.

That’s typically if you did receive lenalidomide in the frontline setting and you would not want to repeat that, then we would typically give you R chemo in a second line setting. Again, in most of those situations, it would be RCP or Bendamustine and Rituximab.

Katherine:                  

Okay. Are there emerging approaches for treating follicular lymphoma that patients should know about?

Dr. Phillips:                 

There are. So, there are some more exciting data that’s coming out, specifically looking at CAR-T, which is chimeric antigen receptor therapy. So, these are augmented T cells that they collect from the patient, they help recognize – they help to modify those cancer cells to recognize the tumor more appropriately. And they target those tumor cells through a receptor called CD19 that’s present on the tumor.

So, that therapy has shown a significant overall response rate in follicular lymphoma. Even in very heavily pretreated patients. Right now, we’re still waiting on a longer follow up as far as the duration of the response, but as of right now it is a very encouraging therapy.

The downside to that therapy is that you can only receive it at select centers because they have to be a therapeutic approved center. So, you can’t just go sometimes to your regular oncologist’s in say, Skoboken or wherever, and get this treatment. So that’s one downside to that and also, it’s a very expensive treatment and you need insurance approval to cover that. Some of the side effects from that treatment we have gotten better at controlling, such as cytokine release syndrome, which can cause fever, low blood pressures, difficulty breathing.

That typically happens within a set period of time after the infusion of the [inaudible] and modified T cells. And then there’s also what we call neurotoxicity, meaning you can have some neurological complications. Which, again, we’ve become better at managing. There are a couple CAR-T products on the market right now; all of them seem very comparable and also effective in follicular lymphoma. There’s also treatments called bispecific antibodies, these are like causally off the shelf products, except they use an antibody.

And in this antibody it has sort of two receptors. So, earlier we talked about Rituximab, which is a CD20 antibody. The bispecifics have a CD20 antibody and a CD3 antibody set. So, they bind to the tumor and also bind to your T cells. And with the binding to the T-cells, they call it T-cell activation and expansion. And it will utilize your own T cells to fight off the cancer. So, because these bispecifics are given as an off the shelf product, they can likely be able to be given in more accessible areas.

So, you won’t have to select centers to be given. There are still some complications with those, such as CRS and neurotoxicity, but early reports indicate that they’re much less severe and less frequency than what we see with CAR-T. But as of right now, neither the duration of responses of these treatments are still to be determined. So, again, these are two exciting sort of avenues that are moving forward for patients with follicular lymphoma that will be further developed and sort of be expanded on in the coming years.

Katherine:                  

What about clinical trials? How do they fit in?

Dr. Phillips:                 

So, for patients with relapsed refractory disease and even some patients with untreated disease, clinical trials are sometimes your best avenue for getting some of these new and promising therapeutics before they get approval. I know sometimes patients are very cautious about clinical trials because they don’t want to be guinea pigs. But I would say all treatments that we offer you have started in clinical trials. And this is the only way to really advance the field. So, if your treating physician has a clinical trial for you, I would strongly recommend patients consider that.

Because, again, they are typically offering you something that they can’t offer you as a standard care, insurance approved treatment. And for the most part, they’re either adding drugs to what we do as far as standard of care treatment approach or offer you something that is very promising in the relapsed refractory setting or upfront setting. That compares very favorably to what we would give you as a standard of care option. That allows you to get this option sooner and earlier when you’re in better shape and less sort of beat up from the other treatments that we would give you.

Katherine:                  

I’d like to just go back for a second and ask you about inhibitor treatments.

Dr. Phillips:                 

Sure. So, as of right now, CAR-T with the chimeric antigen receptor therapy treatment is only approved for patients with relapsed refractory disease. The bispecific antibody therapies are only available in clinical trial. There are some other sort of cyclin inhibitors that haven’t gotten approval. So, we have the PO3 kind of Delta inhibitors, which inhibit the PO3 kind of pathway in a patient with follicular lymphoma.

There were four approved agents in this class of drugs. We had umbralisib, duvelisib, copanlisib, and idelalisib. More recently, two of those, idelalisib and duvelisib, have removed their indications for follicular lymphoma.

So, as of right now we have copanlisib which is an IDP kind of three dose inhibitor and umbralisib, which is an oral agent for the PO3 dose kind of inhibitor. So, both of those agents are typically usually targeted in the third line and beyond. So, patients who fail at least two lines of therapy. We also have tazemetostat, which is an EZH2 inhibitor, that was most recently improved. So, EZH2 mutations occur in about 20% of patients for follicular lymphoma.

But tazemetostat was actually approved for those with and without the mutation as it did show some efficacy in both. It appeared that the overall response rate was a bit higher than those who had an EZH2 mutation, with the duration of the response appears to be equivalent. But I do think for most parts in that situation, for those who lack the mutation the drug is typically used for patients who are unfit for other therapies. Whereas those who have the mutation, it typically probably will be used a bit earlier.

Katherine:                  

Okay. Excellent. Let’s take a moment to talk about patient self-advocacy. Patients can sometimes feel like they’re bothering their healthcare team with their questions and their comments. Why is it important for patients to speak up when it comes to symptoms and side effects?

Dr. Phillips:                 

Well, for the side effect part it’s important because your physician can’t potentially prevent the worst thing or further development of side effects. Nobody can. And also, they can’t prevent you from going to the hospital if you don’t let them know you have this certain side effects.

So, it’s very important to communicate side effects, because for the most part there are logical next steps that we can implement to either eliminate the side effects or hopefully prevent them from future treatment regimens. And also, other concerns that you may have. I mean, you only get one life. And this is your body. Then for the best part, it’s best to communicate any concerns that you may have in regard to treatment, or any questions you may have so that you are well aware.

You can’t really fight this appropriately without sort of being well aware of what you’re dealing with, what we’re using to take care of the cancer, and what potential side effects may come up. Again, so we can, again, have you have the best experience possible to try to get your cancer under control. I try to explain to my patients, “I don’t want you to wait until the next visit if you have issues.” I mean, we need to sort of manage these in real time. Even things we don’t take care of right then and there, again, it gives us a heads up and a head start to try to take care of these problems the next time you come to the clinic.

Katherine:                  

Dr. Phillips, to close, what would you like to leave the audience with? Are you hopeful?

Dr. Phillips:                 

So, I think follicular lymphoma, and lymphoma in general, we are having a better understanding of the biology of the cancer, certain things that are important to the cancer, and certain avenues that we can treat the cancer and avoid some toxicities that have sort of plagued us before. So, I think moving forward there is a ton of research going into improving outcomes for patients with lymphoma, and follicular lymphoma, in general. There are a ton of other treatment options that are coming down the pipe way.

So, I think patients with follicular lymphoma should be very hopeful and encouraged that we will just continue to improve the quality of life and also the duration that they can live with this cancer. I mean, as of right now, until we can cure this cancer, our real goal is to continue to buy you more time. And time buys you more treatments. And most of the treatments that we are developing and are coming, again, down the pipeline are less toxic than some of the things we had 5, 10, definitely 15, 20 years ago.

So, your experience and your quality of life will be improved, and these treatments will also give you more longevity than you could have ever expected. So, patients with lymphoma are living a lot longer and that’s not an important thing to remember. Not hopeful, not – sorry, it’s not hopeless, even though we may say we can’t cure your cancer, the goal is as of right now is to turn this into a chronic disease such as any other chronic disease. Something that you can live with, while managing control. Hopefully, you will continue to enjoy your life and your life won’t be cut short by this cancer.

Katherine:                  

Dr. Phillips, thanks so much for joining us today. We really appreciate it.

Dr. Phillips:                 

No, thank you. I really enjoyed it.

Katherine:                  

And thank you to all of our partners. Please continue to send in your questions to question@powerfulpatients.org. and we’ll work to get them answered in future programs. If you would like to watch this webinar again, there will be a replay available soon. You’ll received an email when it’s ready.

And don’t forget to take the survey immediately following this webinar. It will help us as we plan future programs. To learn more about follicular lymphoma, and to access tools to help you become a more proactive patient, visit powerfulpatients.org. I’m Katherine Banwell. Thanks for being with us today.

What Do You Need to Know About Diffuse Large B-Cell Lymphoma (DLBCL)?

What Do You Need to Know about Diffuse Large B-Cell Lymphoma (DLBCL)? from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

 After a diffuse large B-cell Lymphoma (DLBCL) diagnosis, what’s important for patients and their loved ones to know? This animated video provides an understanding of DLBCL, available treatment options and lists key steps for becoming an empowered patient.

See More From The Pro-Active DLBCL Patient Toolkit


Related Programs:

Factors that Guide a DLBCL Treatment Decision

 
What Is Diffuse Large B-cell Lymphoma (DLBCL)?

Essential Testing Following a DLBCL Diagnosis

Essential Testing Following a DLBCL Diagnosis 


Transcript:

Hi, my name is Dr. Williams, and I am a hematologist-oncologist specializing in diffuse large B-cell lymphoma—commonly known as DLBCL.

Today, I’m going to talk about what you need to know if you or a loved one has been diagnosed with DLBCL.

First, it’s important to understand your disease.

DLBCL is the most common form of non-Hodgkin lymphoma, which is a type of cancer that begins in the lymphatic system. The lymphatic system is part of the body’s immune system and includes tissue and organs that create, carry, and store white blood cells. DLBCL is caused when white blood cells called lymphocytes rapidly grow out of control.

It may be localized to the lymph nodes or may occur OUTSIDE of the lymphatic system in areas such as the thyroid, skin, breast, bone, testes, gastrointestinal tract—or even other organs in the body.

In many cases, an early sign of the disease is swollen lymph nodes. Patients may also experience symptoms that can include fever, unintended weight loss, night sweats, and fatigue. These are known as “B” symptoms. Depending on where the lymphoma is in the body, it could cause other symptoms as well.

Next, it’s important to understand how DLBCL is typically treated.

Because it is fast-growing, treatment usually begins quickly to help control the disease and its symptoms. The standard of treatment is a regimen called R-CHOP, which combines chemotherapy and a monoclonal antibody. This approach can lead to disease remission in many patients.

If a patient doesn’t respond to initial chemotherapy treatment or relapses, then several other types of treatment are considered, such as:

  • Alternative chemotherapy
  • Stem cell transplant
  • Targeted treatment
  • CAR T-cell therapy
  • And clinical trials

When making treatment decisions, factors such as where the disease is in your body, and lab test results can impact available options. And potential side effects, a patient’s age, health, and lifestyle are also taken into consideration.

In addition to understanding your disease and treatment options, it’s vital to be an active partner in your care. So, how can you take steps to be an empowered patient?

  • Educate yourself about DLBCL.
  • Consider a second opinion or consult with a DLBCL specialist immediately following a diagnosis.
  • Write down your questions before and during your appointments. Visit powerfulpatients.org/dlbcl to access office visit planners to help you organize your notes.
  • Understand the goals of treatment and ask whether a clinical trial might be right for you.
  • Bring a friend or loved one to your appointments to help you recall information and to keep track of important details.
  • Finally, remember that you have a voice in your care decisions. Don’t hesitate to ask questions and to share your concerns. You are your own best advocate.

DLBCL Treatment Decisions: What’s Right for You?

DLBCL Treatment Decisions: What’s Right for You? from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

When considering therapy for diffuse large b-cell lymphoma (DLBCL), what determines the best treatment for YOU? Lymphoma expert Dr. Loretta Nastoupil shares key decision-making factors, emerging research, and tools for partnering with your healthcare team.

Dr. Loretta Nastoupil is the Director of the Lymphoma Outcomes Database and Section Chief of New Drug Development in the Department of Lymphoma/Myeloma, Division of Cancer Medicine at The University of Texas MD Anderson Cancer Center. Learn more about Dr. Nastoupil here.

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Transcript:

Katherine:

All right. Hello and welcome. I’m Katherine Banwell, your host for today’s program. Today, we’re going to discuss how you can be proactive in your DLBCL care and work with your healthcare team to find the best treatment path for you.

Before we meet our guest, let’s review a few important details. The reminder email you received about this program contains a link to program materials. If you haven’t already, click that link to access information to follow along during this webinar.

At the end of this program, you’ll receive a link to a program survey. Please take a moment to provide feedback about your experience today in order to help us plan future webinars.

Finally, before we get into the discussion, please remember that this program is not a substitute for seeking medical advice. Please, refer to your healthcare team about what might be best for you.

All right. Let’s find out who we’re talking to today. Joining me is Dr. Loretta Nastoupil. Thank you so much for coming on the show with us. Would you please introduce yourself?

Dr. Nastoupil:

Sure. Thanks, Katherine. I’m Loretta Nastoupil. I’m in the Department of Lymphoma and Myeloma at the University of Texas MD Anderson Cancer Center. I’ve been here since 2013, and I currently lead our new drug development team in our lymphoma section.

Katherine:

Thank you so much for taking time out of your busy schedule to join us. So, let’s start with a basic question, what is diffuse large B-cell lymphoma or DLBCL?

Dr. Nastoupil:

That’s a really important question. And I spend a lot of time when I first meet patients explaining to them there are a lot of different terms that are thrown around in lymphoma. Particularly, non-Hodgkin lymphoma is a term many patients will hear and even use. And I remind them that that is sort of an umbrella term that describes essentially every lymphoma that’s not Hodgkin lymphoma.

So, it’s really important to recognize that there are unique types of large cell lymphoma. And almost everything that we care about in terms of what the treatment will look like, whether or not we’re aiming to cure someone, or just maintain adequate disease control is primarily focused on the type of lymphoma someone has.

So, diffuse large B-cell lymphoma is the most common lymphoma subtype. Just in terms of its descriptive name, it is a B-cell cancer. And it is comprised of large cells that are essentially effacing or replacing the architecture of a lymph node.

There are different types, which I’m sure we’ll discuss. But, again, diffuse large B-cell lymphoma is our most frequent lymphoma we encounter.

Katherine:

What is B cell? What does that mean?

Dr. Nastoupil:

Sure. So, stepping back a little bit, I think most people when they know or have known someone with cancer, it is described as the organ it originates in. So, breast cancer’s a great example. That usually is breast tissue that is abnormal. It has malignant potential. And if it spreads beyond its capsule and specifically goes to a lymph node or another organ, generally that’s bad news.

Lymphoma is a cancer of the immune system. And there are various types of immune cells. B cells – they mature on and become plasma cells when they’re behaving normally. And their job is to generate antibodies so that we can develop immunity from exposures or infections we’ve had and we’ve recovered from.

So, if you develop a cancer in the B cell, depending what stage of development – if it’s a stem cell, for instance, that can lead to acute leukemia. If it’s an immature B cell, meaning it has not developed into a plasma cell, that’s, generally, where diffuse large B-cell lymphoma arises. So, these cells tend to live or spend most of their time in lymph nodes because they’re trying to mimic the behavior of a normal B cell where they’re waiting there for that exposure to happen.

So, these are generally not cancers that we try to cut out before they spread. They’re not spreading cancers in terms of how we generally think of those, meaning you’re not going to use surgery to treat it. And, oftentimes, there are malignant B cells kind of dispersed throughout the body because if you think about how your immune system should work, it should be able to fight off an infection anywhere and everywhere.

So, I think those are key things to keep in mind because oftentimes patients will have widespread involvement or lymph node involvement or bone involvement, and that’s just the nature of the disease and not necessarily something that is so far progressed we didn’t catch it early enough.

Katherine:

I see. Are there subtypes of DLBCL?

Dr. Nastoupil:

Yes, absolutely. So, again, stepping back, over the last 20 years, we have tried to understand why we’re able to cure about 60 percent of patients. But for the 40 percent that were not cured with standard treatment, their outcomes were generally poor, meaning most of those patients died as a result of their lymphoma.

And we’ve approached all of them the same. So, that would imply to us that there’s something inherently different about the large cell lymphoma cases that don’t respond to standard treatment. So, an attempt to try and define who those patients are before we initiate treatment, as technology has evolved, we’ve interrogated some of those biopsy samples to try and understand is there an underlying biologic rationale as to why some patients would have very, very disparate outcomes?

So, what we’ve learned is there are genes that are differentiated between different subtypes of large cell lymphoma. And we’ve described those subtypes based off those gene expression patterns. So, there is a germinal center type of large cell lymphoma. There’s a non-germinal center or activated B-cell type.

And then it gets much more complicated meaning there’s probably far more than just two subtypes. Right now, we’re describing at least five different subtypes. I think what’s important for patients to know is that we view this in terms of being able to predict who’s not going to have the typical course. And if we can define who they are, we might pursue something different, including potentially a clinical trial.

So, the subtypes I care the most about right now in terms of defining are the double hit or double expressors, those with other features that might lend itself to targeted therapy.

So, this is an evolving field and will continue I’m sure – that will have more subtypes defined over time.

Katherine:

Let’s look into testing for a moment. What tests are essential when making a diagnosis?

Dr. Nastoupil:

So, at the beginning, we clearly have to have tissue. I always say, “Tissue is the issue.” So, we may have features that are suggestive of lymphoma. And even sometimes radiologists will describe a CT scan or an x-ray and say, “This looks very suspicious for lymphoma.” But unless we actually have a biopsy that confirms lymphoma, we won’t go as far as to render a diagnosis in the absence of a biopsy.

Now our biopsy approaches have evolved over the last few years. The gold standard or what I would consider to be the best approach currently is to actually have an incisional biopsy meaning we find a lymph node that looks suspicious.

And we either remove the entire lymph node or a large section of that lymph node to render a diagnosis because there’s various things we need to do to that lymph node.

So, generally, we do what’s called immunohistochemistry staining. So, we stain either surface markers of those cells or markers within the cell because cancer is defined as having an abnormal clone or a population of cells that all have the same features. And they’re able to survive even if the host is not thriving.

So, that’s, essentially, what we’re trying to define. Are there cells in this lymph node that are all the same? And what features do they share in common? And then we will also do something called flow cytometry where we’ll take these cells and essentially sort them according to those surface markers. And that will also tell us – is this a B-cell clone, a T-cell clone, and what features would distinguish one lymphoma from another?

And the last thing that we need tissue for are what we call molecular studies, where we may learn about either genes that are rearranged or mutated within those cells that, again, may help us further classify the lymphoma and, again, group them into higher or potentially lower risk groups.

Katherine:

What do the results of these tests tell us about prognosis and treatment choices?

Dr. Nastoupil:

So, again, everything kind of hinges on what type of lymphoma we’re facing. So, for instance, diffuse large B-cell lymphoma is what we call an aggressive lymphoma. So, what does that mean? It can grow very quickly. It can take over the patient in terms of resources. So, generally, patients will have weight loss and sometimes even constitutional symptoms or B symptoms, such as night sweats and fevers, fatigue.

In the absence of treatment, it is universally fatal. Now, that timeline can vary from one person to another. But, generally, within a year, if we don’t treat large cell lymphoma, generally, that’s not survivable.

But as I’ve also mentioned for at least 60 percent of patients and potentially even more, we can cure it with standard treatment. There are other types of lymphoma, such as indolent B-cell lymphomas where actually the goal is not cure, but patients may actually have a normal life expectancy meaning they will face multiple treatment courses over their lifetime. But at the end of the day, they should live just as long as someone their same age and sex who doesn’t have lymphoma.

So, again, that’s gonna be a vastly different treatment course and outcome. So, sometimes, when you’re sitting in the waiting room and you’re sharing your journey with others, you have to keep in mind that you may all be using the same term, non-Hodgkin lymphoma. But our expectations in terms of to and outcomes might be vastly different.

Katherine:

From person to person. What are the stages of DLBCL?

Dr. Nastoupil:

So, we currently use what’s called the Ann Arbor staging system. And, again, this is very different from the staging applied in solid tumors.

And so, the way we define stage is based off where the tumor is in relationship to the diaphragm. So, if you have the disease just in lymph nodes and it’s all confined to one side of the diaphragm, it’s either gonna be stage one or two. And how we distinguish between one or two is just really not are they in close proximity and something that we would fit in one radiation field.

If you have disease that’s above and below the diaphragm, that’s generally at least Stage 3. Stage 4 is generally when it’s now outside of the lymph node. So, what we call extranodal location. So, those are generally organs, lung, liver, skin, bone, etcetera.

It can be very complicated in that you could have just one extranodal site. So, say you just have stomach involvement, or you just have one area of the bone. That could be a 1E.

So, it’s important to recognize every patient has a stage. What that means is whether or not we would give a full course of therapy in terms of systemic treatment that goes through the vein or maybe a shortened course in radiation is dependent on that stage.

Katherine:

Now that we understand a bit more about DLBCL and how it’s staged, let’s move on to treatment options. Many factors come in to play when making a treatment decision, including a patient’s age and overall health. So, let’s walk through some of these considerations. Let’s start with treatment goals. What does this mean exactly? And what are the goals of treatment for DLBCL?

Dr. Nastoupil:

Great questions. For diffuse large B-cell lymphoma, my goal was that I want to eradicate this disease with one course of therapy. Now one course of therapy, again, may mean six cycles of treatment, or it may mean three to four plus/minus radiation. And that kind of gets back to the discussion we just had with stage. But the goal is to make it go away and never come back. Now, oncologists are eternal optimists.

And I saw this because we would not be oncologists if we weren’t always focused and hoping for the best outcomes for our patients.

Katherine:

Sure.

Dr. Nastoupil:

So, we, generally, when we’re counseling patients tend to keep the focus on what is the chance that I can cure this, and we use words like cure oftentimes. But there’s always those caveats. And those caveats are – we can’t really look into our crystal ball and predict the future for every given patient. So, we use tools to help us risk stratify patients, meaning if we took 100 people like a given person, we could predict the outcome for the majority of those patients.

So, with diffuse large B-cell lymphoma with no high-risk features – so, that gets back to the molecular subtype. Do they have double hit features – yes or no? The stage and something we call IPI, International Prognostic Index, that takes into account some clinical features. As you mentioned, patient specific factors, their age, their stage, some lab values, whether or not they have more than one extranodal variable. Then we can generally predict.

Again, if I have 100 patients with good risk IPI, 80 percent of them are likely to be cured and alive and well five to 10 years later. If I have someone with poor risk features that may not change exactly what I do for that patient, but that may help them and me in terms of should I be pursuing a trial to potentially have access to something that’s better than this standard option? Or how does this impact their planning?

Some people are close to retirement. Some people have specific life goals, such as a wedding or an anniversary that sometimes we use those sorts of calculators to best predict the future to inform some of that treatment. So, those are what we call sort of the characteristics coming into treatment.

There are comorbidities or sort of concomitant medical problems, such as heart disease, sometimes diabetes. But, generally, more often than not, it’s how healthy your heart is because my objective with treatment is to cure this.

Cure generally results from chemotherapy. And we can spend some time talking about why have we not moved away from chemotherapy in this disease? But, generally, that does involve chemo because that’s generally how I can eradicate this tumor.

But there are certain situations where that chemo may not be beneficial to a given a patient. It usually has to do with how healthy their heart function is at baseline. So, again, we look at all of these factors. What is their risk with the disease? What is their risk from the toxicity of treatment? And am I able to achieve that goal, which is to eradicate the disease?

Katherine: Well, let’s talk about chemotherapy. Why is that still part of the regimen in a treatment plan?

Dr. Nastoupil:

Yes, I’m gonna borrow an analogy that one of my colleagues Jason Westin uses all the time. The CHOP chemotherapy that is the backbone of our treatment for diffuse large B-cell lymphoma was developed in 1976.

There is no other technology that we would commonly use in our day to day. You wouldn’t still be driving your car you had in 1976. Clearly, our methods of communication in regards to phones have changed dramatically. So, why are we still using chemotherapy that was developed in 1976?

Katherine:

True.

Dr. Nastoupil:

Well, it’s not for lack of trying. Over the last four or five decades, we have been trying to improve upon this. And it works. It works for at least 60 percent of patients. When we tack on targeted therapy, such as immune therapy where we use an antibody that will stick to the surface of a marker on that lymphoma cell and then use the immune system to do some of the heavy lifting, we can probably improve those cure rates from 60 percent to potentially as high as 80 percent. That’s really been the only substantial improvement we’ve made.

Now, there is one caveat. So, just recently, we heard a press release of the POLARIX study, which is the first trial in the last four decades that could potentially replace R-CHOP as the standard of care.

We don’t have the full results yet. It’s essentially utilizing a drug called polatuzumab, which is an antibody drug conjugate. It’s essentially chemo on a stick. But we’re delivering chemo specifically to (CD)79b, which is a target on B cell lymphomas and modifying the CHOPs. We’re not getting rid of chemo altogether. We’re dropping one of the chemotherapy agents and replacing it with this targeted agent. So, it’s essentially CHP plus rituximab and polatuzumab might be the new standard.

But, again, that’s based off many, many efforts to try and replace CHOP. And we’re making slow incremental improvements, but we’re still keeping the therapies that tend to work.

Katherine:

And that makes sense. What about biomarker testing results?

Dr. Nastoupil:

So, in a perfect world, we would be able to take a patient’s specific tumor, sequence it, and provide a recipe or a solution to solve the problem. And that’s what a biomarker is.

It’s something that’s unique to the patient’s given tumor that then would inform what is the best treatment. So, we’re lacking in some ways a perfect scenario. What we do have, as what I’ve mentioned, some molecular studies where we can look for specific genes or rearrangements in the genes that may help us predict the future.

And in diffuse large B-cell lymphoma, one of the most common examples of this is what we call double hit where we’re looking for two genes – MYC, which is M-Y-C, and either BCL2 or BCL6. These are genes that we all have. It’s just the lymphoma has moved these genes into sort of more of a prime real estate location that makes it a little bit more resistant to standard treatments.

So, if you move those genes in that tumor DNA, we call that our rearrangement. And we pick that up based off a FISH study. And if both of those features or all three of those features are there, we call it a double or triple hit.

That’s a potential biomarker that may suggest that particularly R-CHOP or standard treatment may not be the best strategy. There’s some limitations to that conclusion in that that’s not true for every patient. For about 20 percent to 30 percent of patients with double hit features, they’re gonna do really well with R-CHOP.

So, that’s why we are lacking in how effective these biomarkers are. And it would be great if we had additional biomarkers that were more precise or could tell us more than just that the standard may not be optimal.

So, that’s where we’re spending a great deal of time and effort in our research efforts just trying to identify biomarkers that may tell us what’s the best approach for a given patient or what we like to call personalized medicine.

Katherine:

Exactly. Does treatment typically start right away?

Dr. Nastoupil:

Hopefully. So, what I mean by that is everyone has to have a diagnosis. And a common story that I hear is that patients generally know when they’re not doing well. They may not be able to pinpoint I have lymphoma.

But they usually will see a primary care doctor or depending on the location of a lymph node if it’s palpable. Oftentimes, men when they’re shaving will pick up a lymph node in the neck. Or women if they’re having a mammogram will pick up a lymph node in the axillae or under the arm. So, that may lead to further investigation based off the location of a lymph node.

Or it may just be those constitutional symptoms where people aren’t feeling well, and a primary care doctor is their first stop. Lymphoma is rare. So, usually it’s a diagnosis of exclusion or something that we eventually get around to. That is important, but it’s not that important.

So, what I mean by that is I hope patients don’t have any guilt or regret if they’ve been sitting on symptoms for a while or even if their primary care doctor missed signs and symptoms of lymphoma because, again, it’s not very specific. There are a lot of things that can cause similar presentations.

But once we have imaging that is suggestive of lymphoma and then we have a diagnosis that’s rendered, again, followed by a biopsy, generally, then it is important that they seek care.

And they get that care in a timely fashion. What’s kind of interesting is the longer time from diagnosis to the initiation of treatment in diffuse large B-cell lymphoma is usually associated with a better prognosis. So, that’s sort of counterintuitive.

One would think that the sooner you get started on treatment, the better your outcome will be. I think the challenge with interpreting that data is that the longer time from diagnosis to initiation of treatment usually means that that patient’s disease is one that lends itself to the affordability of time to be seen by specialists, have all of your staging studies completed, have a return visit to go over all those results and have a shared decision-making process in terms of deciding what’s the best treatment for you, and then getting started on that treatment.

So, those patients where that is agreeable and acceptable, they’re probably gonna do very well.

For the patients who are really sick and they need to get started on treatment sooner rather later as a result of their disease putting them at risk, either as a result of organs not functioning well or substantial symptom burden as a result of their disease, then they need to get started. So, that’s usually why their course from diagnosis to treatment is generally shorter.

So, again, it all kind of depends on a given situation. But with diffuse large B-cell lymphoma, I tell patients usually within three months of knowing you have lymphoma, we need to get you on treatment, or you’re gonna be sick.

Katherine:

I can imagine. You touched on this a few moments ago. But what do you feel is the patient’s role in this whole decision?

Dr. Nastoupil:

So, I’ve actually been a patient myself, and I have mixed feelings about it. I think oftentimes as an oncologist, we share decision-making when we don’t know the exact path forward, meaning if there’s something controversial or you have more than one option, generally, we kind of put out all the information to the patient, and we want you to be part of that decision-making.

And I think that’s important because we’re all humans, and we all want liberties. And we want our patient rights to be acknowledged and respected. And that’s important. I think sometimes though that also burdens patients with making decisions when they may feel they don’t have all of the information to make an informed decision.

But your role as the patient is you know your body better than anyone. And, generally, if there’s something that just doesn’t fit well or sit well with you, be vocal about it. So, I’ve been in a situation where I felt like I had to speak up a few times, and not that I have all the answers. And I am an oncologist. So, I generally have more insight than others.

But, generally, I was right in that, again, I think we know our own bodies. And when you feel that something is being missed or maybe not given the time and attention it deserves, speak up. You also have a role in making sure that the diagnosis is correct.

So, I generally advise all patients because everything hinges on the diagnosis in lymphoma, more so than the staging, more so than sometimes even the treatment itself.

Getting a second opinion can be incredibly valuable because you have another pathologist that will lay eyes on this biopsy. And lymphoma is rare. So, a second opinion can be incredibly valuable, and that’s usually something driven by a patient more so than an oncologist. Though some oncologists – and I would say the majority – are open to an opinion because they too would like information or confirmation that they’re on the right path.

Katherine:

Certainly.

Dr. Nastoupil:

The other thing that I think patients can have role is exploring what trial options are out there and available to them. I think that is sometimes a tough subject to discuss. Clinical trials are not only for patients who have failed all the standard treatments.

And it’s usually not an option of hospice versus a clinical trial. That’s absolutely an inappropriate time to consider a clinical trial. And, generally, there are trials at any point in a patient’s journey where there is some controversy as to the best path forward.

Again, I’ve been discussing the last 40 years of trying to improve upon R-CHOP is because 60 percent of patients were cured, but 40 percent were not. There is always a scenario where we could do better. And, generally, the only way we will improve upon outcomes is to conduct important rational clinical trials.

So, sometimes, it’s as simple as reaching out, participating in programs such as this, reaching out to the Lymphoma & Leukemia society or the Lymphoma Research Foundation to just explore what are your trial options. They may not be appropriate for you right now but at least understanding where there is an opportunity to participate in a trial is worth exploring.

Dr. Nastoupil:

Dr. Nastoupil, now that we’ve discussed factors that go into the treatment choices, can you walk us through the currently available DLBCL treatment approaches and who they might be right for?

Dr. Nastoupil:

Absolutely. So, again, this is changing, and that’s good news. So, up until recently, R-CHOP or rituximab in combination with CHOP, which is an acronym for four different drugs, cyclophosphamide, doxorubicin, vincristine, and prednisone, has been our standard.

Again, what would potentially challenge that is the POLARIX study where we exchange vincristine for polatuzumab. We don’t know the results of that study yet. All we know is that it met its primary endpoint, meaning it met what it set out to do in terms of improving upon some of the outcomes achieved with R-CHOP.

We need to see the details to know if that means now every newly diagnosed diffuse large B-cell lymphoma patient will be offered the polatuzumab in combination with R-CHP study or whether or not there will still be some patients appropriate for R-CHOP.

But that is generally our first approach. Whether you get six cycles or a shortened course plus/minus radiation depends on your state. Once patients have completed therapy, generally, then we pursue what’s called surveillance.

So, we’re monitoring for any signs that the lymphoma has recurred or has not gone away. That’s a controversial topic in terms of how to conduct surveillance and one that I suspect will change over time. But for most patients, if the lymphoma is going to recur, it generally recurs within the first two years.

So, assessing patients either in the form of a CT scan, a PET CT, or a physical exam with labs every four to six months for the first two years is what most practices will pursue. I’m not saying that there is no chance that you would relapse beyond two years. It’s just that the majority of patients, at least 90 percent, if the lymphoma comes back, it usually does so within two years.

And the relapses that occur beyond two years are less predictable. They could happen at three years. They could happen at 10 years, as it’s hard to know how to do surveillance beyond two years.

If the lymphoma recurs, the first thing we need to do is biopsy it because there are many things that can mimic lymphoma on a scan – infection, inflammation, other tumor types. So, if there is ever a question about whether or not the lymphoma has recurred, I generally advise for all patients they undergo a biopsy to ensure that we know what we’re treating.

Depending on when the lymphoma recurs, if it happens within 12 months, this is another area that we are shifting our practice. In the past, for all patients who had relapsed large cell lymphoma, we would pursue what we call salvage or second-line chemotherapy. So, we mix up the chemo. We keep, generally, the rituximab, but we alter the chemotherapy agents. We wouldn’t give CHOP again.

And then we give a shortened course where we give two to three cycles. We repeat the scan. And for patients who’ve achieved what we call chemo-sensitive disease – so, that’s generally a complete response on scan – we would then move forward with high-dose therapy and an autologous stem cell transplant. So, essentially giving different but more intense chemo and rescuing patients from that maneuver with their own stem cells that will go back to the bone marrow and start making white blood cells, red cells, and platelets again.

What has shifted in the last six months is we now know that CAR T-cell therapy is superior to that approach, at least with two CAR Ts for patients whose lymphoma came back within 12 months. Again, we’re eagerly awaiting the full results of those randomized studies. But three trials were conducted. Two of the three suggest CAR T is better than second chemo and transplant for those patients who relapse within 12 months.

So, currently, we think that you’ll have a CHOP-like therapy with plus rituximab frontline. If you progress within 12 months, you potentially would be a candidate for CAR T-cell therapy. If the CAR T-cell therapy fails, which is true for about half of patients, or if you’re deemed to not be a candidate for CAR T, we have several other new options that didn’t exist a year ago, including targeted or non-chemotherapy options.

So, there are at least four options in that setting now that are therapies that target the lymphoma cells, either by targeting CD19, which is another surface marker, augmenting that either with an antibody drug conjugate, such as Lonca, or with an immune therapy, such as lenalidomide and tafasitamab. Polatuzumab is available in that third line or later space combined with bendamustine and rituximab. There’s an oral agent called Selinexor.

So, a lot of that is not to burden patients with information but to let them know they’ve got lots of options. And many of these can be sequenced. So, if we can’t achieve cure with R-CHOP and/or CAR T, there are still very good outcomes in that third line or later space.

Katherine:

We’ve covered a lot of information here so far. And just a reminder that the resource guide I mentioned earlier contains definitions and resources for what we’re discussing today. So, be sure to click on that link if you haven’t already.

Dr. Nastoupil, I’m wondering how patients can feel confident in speaking up and becoming a partner in their care.

Dr. Nastoupil:

So, it’s important to recognize, and I reflect on this all the time. Generally, once patients have been rendered a diagnosis of cancer, that’s a life-altering event. And even if I spend a lot of time trying to reassure patients that outcomes for lymphoma patients are very good, generally we’re aiming for cure, that’s not true for everyone.

And you can’t help but be concerned that you will succumb to this disease or that the toxicity of therapy is gonna be life-altering and impact your quality of life in such a way that it’s no longer the life that you were happy to live.

And so, I recognize that we are partners in this. My job is to choose the most effective therapy that will try and accomplish the goals we set out to achieve. However, sometimes, oncologists make assumptions about what the goal of a given patient is.

We’re assuming that longevity or living is the most important goal. Whereas sometimes, people might care more about the quality of life, or they may need more reassurances about what the options are or their realistic outcomes with therapy. Because, again, I’ve mentioned before, oncologists are generally eternal optimists. We tend to sugarcoat things a little bit.
So, it’s important for patients to recognize that they will have a shared decision responsibility, meaning oftentimes we will provide all the information that we have access to in terms of a given treatment.
What is the likelihood of success, what is the potential risk in terms of toxicity, and what we’re leaning towards one therapy over another, particularly if you have more than one option.
But, ultimately, we need patients to share with us what their goals are in terms of outcome of that treatment so that we can then potentially refine our treatment selection. So, again, being informed, participating in programs like this so that you understand what makes one lymphoma different from another. Why would one oncologist offer one treatment and another discuss something else?

So, understanding what the different lymphomas are, how they might be approached differently, what the new therapies are. I struggle to keep up with just the lymphoma literature and changes. I can’t imagine what it must be like for an oncologist that treats every cancer type. So, again, understanding that new drugs are approved almost every couple of months in lymphoma may provide an opportunity for patients to share new information with their oncologists as well. So, information is key.

Katherine:

Dr. Nastoupil, thank you so much for taking the time to join us today.

Dr. Nastoupil:

Well, I appreciate your time as well.

Katherine:

And thank you to all of our partners.

If you would like to watch this webinar again, there will be a replay available soon. You’ll receive an email when it’s ready. And don’t forget to take the survey immediately following this webinar. It will help us as we plan future programs.
To learn more about DLBCL and to access tools to help you become a proactive patient, visit powerfulpatients.org. I’m Katherine Banwell. Thanks for joining us today.

Should You Have Prostate Cancer Genetic Testing?

Should You Have Prostate Cancer Genetic Testing? from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

Should you ask for prostate cancer genetic testing? Dr. Nima Sharifi discusses prostate cancer genetics and shares his perspective on how testing can help ensure the best care for a patient.

Dr. Nima Sharifi is Director of the Genitourinary (GU) Malignancies Research Center at the Cleveland Clinic. Learn more here.

See more from The Pro-Active Prostate Cancer Patient Toolkit

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Prostate Cancer Treatment Decisions: How Do Genetic Test Results Impact Your Options?

Targeted Prostate Cancer Therapies vs. Chemotherapy: What’s the Difference?

Prostate Cancer Staging: What Patients Should Know

 


Transcript:

Dr. Sharifi:

I think it’s okay when you’re speaking with your physician to say that you’re concerned about the genetics of prostate cancer. You can ask about personalized medicine treatment options, and whether genetic testing would make a difference for treatments.

 

And you can also bring up the concern about family members, and that there may be an inherited or heritable component of cancer that could be passed down, for example, from one generation to the next and that could be shared among siblings. I think there’s nothing wrong with bringing that up. And I would suggest that if that’s a concern, that a man does bring that up with their physician.                                   

 

So, it turns out that there are certain germline mutations that can predispose to several different types of cancers.

 

For example, these BRCA mutations can predispose to developing prostate and perhaps more aggressive prostate cancer, but they can also predispose to developing breast cancer. So, if you look, for example, at members of a family who are related, you may see that certain cancers may develop in multiple family members. So, if you see that that – If you look at your family history and you see that that is the case, then you may want to think about genetic testing and perhaps to see a genetic counselor to talk about getting tested.

Prostate Cancer Treatment Decisions: How Do Genetic Test Results Impact Your Options?

Prostate Cancer Treatment Decisions: How Do Genetic Test Results Impact Your Options? from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

How do genetic test results impact prostate cancer treatment options? Dr. Nima Sharifi explains BRCA mutations, germline genes, and somatic mutations—and discusses when treatment with PARP inhibitors may be appropriate.

Dr. Nima Sharifi is Director of the Genitourinary (GU) Malignancies Research Center at the Cleveland Clinic. Learn more here.

See More From INSIST! Prostate Cancer

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Transcript:

Dr. Sharifi:        

There are several types of mutations that occur in prostate cancer. We know about a lot of them. We’re beginning to understand the function of many of them, and the role of just a few of them has become a bit clearer in treatment of prostate cancer. So, the one that I think has the clearest implications is something called BRCA mutations.

So, you can get mutations in genes that regulate DNA damage. This can occur in either inherited genes, or these are mutations that can occur in the cancer itself. And this will allow for tumors to become the developed – actually, greater DNA damage. The implications of using this information, genetic testing for these BRCA mutations, are actually several. One is that it may – if it comes in through the germline, then it tells us something about the hereditary or familial component of it.

So, that has implications not only for the patient but also potentially family members. And then the second set of implications has to do with treatment, and specifically treatment that in more advanced cases where there are now two FDA-approved agents that are used specifically for patients who have mutations in these genes.

And we’re still learning a lot about what these genes mean, or mutations of these genes mean for patients in their clinical course. And we’re learning much more information about other mutations which may occur in prostate cancer as well.

So, we should draw a distinction between two different types of genes. One is germline. Germline has to do with the DNA or the genes that you inherit from your parents. And the second category is somatic mutations, or somatic genetics. And this, specifically, has to do with mutations that occur in the cancer cell itself, but that are not inherited from one’s parents.

It’s a very active area of research. So, again, for the vast majority of mutations that we recognize in prostate cancer, we don’t use that to make clinical decisions. There are a few, such as the DNA damage repair genes or BRCA genes – which tell us something about the potential for a more aggressive disease course or a more aggressive disease – and also the potential appropriateness of using agents called PARP inhibitors, which seem to specifically work in patients who have mutations in the BRCA family of genes.

So, in terms of the treatment options, the major genetic tests that allow us to figure out whether systemic or drug treatment option is appropriate or not, is in DNA damage repair genes such as BRCA.

So, for example, in the case of metastatic disease that’s resistant to hormonal therapy and has already been treated with other therapies, if there is a mutation in BRCA or one of the closely related gene members, then use of a drug called a PARP inhibitor may be appropriate, and that could benefit patients.

Navigating Lung Cancer Treatment Decisions

Navigating Lung Cancer Treatment Decisions from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

What steps could help you and your doctor decide on the best treatment path for your individual disease? This animated video walks through key considerations, including molecular testing results, lifestyle factors and patient preference.

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Diagnosed with Lung Cancer? An Expert Outlines Key Steps


Transcript:

Hi, I’m Kendra. I’m a nurse practitioner and I specialize in lung cancer.

When diagnosed with lung cancer, it’s important to take steps to get a deeper understanding of your disease, and the available treatment options, so that you can feel confident in your care decisions.

Before we walk through the actions that can help you decide on a treatment path, I want to remind you that this video is intended to help educate lung cancer patients and their loved ones and shouldn’t be a replacement for advice from your doctor.

OK, let’s get started.

The first step is to understand your diagnosis—including the type of lung cancer and stage of disease—so that you can find out what treatments are available to you. Your physician will use tests, including biopsies and imaging, such as X-rays and CT scans, to ensure you have an accurate diagnosis.

The next step is to understand the approaches available for YOUR individual disease.
Depending on your stage and type of lung cancer, treatments can include:

  • Surgery
  • Radiation therapy
  • Chemotherapy
  • Targeted therapy or
  • Immunotherapy

Or, you may receive a combination of one or more of these treatments.

Other testing that can impact your treatment options is molecular testing, which is used to identify specific mutations that are unique to your lung cancer. This may help in deciding if targeted therapies are an appropriate option for you.

Before you start any treatment, it’s essential to ask your doctor if you have had relevant molecular testing.

Another option that your physician may discuss with you is clinical trials, which may provide access to treatments that are not yet approved. At different points on your path with lung cancer, it’s important to talk with your doctor about whether there is a clinical trial that could be right for you.

Once you understand the treatments that are available to you, it’s time to talk to your doctor about the risks and benefits of each option and walk through the goals of your treatment.

One of the most important factors that your healthcare team will consider is YOUR treatment goals. Remember, you are a partner in your care and have an active voice in finding the best treatment for you. Physicians also typically consider a patient’s age, overall health, and existing conditions before they suggest a course.

So, what questions should you address when you are discussing your treatment goals with your doctor? Consider asking:

  • Is the goal of the treatment to cure your disease or to obtain long-term control your disease?
  • How effective will the treatment be and how will it impact your quality of life and lifestyle?
  • What are the treatment side effects–both the short-term effects as well as long-term effects that may occur after you have completed treatment?
  • Is there a member of the team, such as a social worker, that can help you understand the potential treatment costs? And is there access to financial resources that can help you if needed?
  • Are there supportive care options that can help with symptoms and pain management at any stage of your cancer?

It also may be a good idea to consider a second, or even third opinion consultation with a specialist. And, if you don’t feel supported or you don’t feel heard by your healthcare team, then it is always best to get another opinion.

Finally, once you have gathered all the information, it may be helpful to talk it out with people you trust, such as a partner, friend or family member, to help you make a decision that you feel confident about.

Now, how can you put this information to work for you?

  • Make sure you understand your type and stage of your lung cancer and the goals of your treatment options.
  • Talk to your physician about what you’ve learned.
  • Consider a consultation with a lung cancer specialist.
  • Ask about molecular testing and what testing results mean for you.
  • Discuss whether clinical trials are an option for your cancer.
  • Visit credible online resources to stay up to date on lung cancer information.
  • Visit powerfulpatients.org/lungcancer to learn more about lung cancer.

How Can You Insist on Better Prostate Cancer Care?

How Can You Insist on Better Prostate Cancer Care? from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo

How can prostate cancer patients access the best care in an evolving treatment landscape? Prostate cancer survivor Jim Schraidt shares his advice for staying up-to-date about treatment developments and for accessing support and resources

Jim Schraidt is a prostate cancer survivor and Chairman of the Board of Directors for Us TOO International. Learn more about Jim Schraidt here.

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Newly Diagnosed with Prostate Cancer? Consider These Key Steps

 


Transcript:

Jim Schraidt:              

The really great news is that sort of across the board, from early stage disease through metastatic prostate cancer patients, there are advances that are occurring very rapidly at this point, so rapidly that practitioners have difficulty keeping up with them.

And, honestly, those of us who do some patients support likewise have difficulty keeping up with them. I think, once again, these support groups can serve a useful function in that you have specific questions, you hear about it, you bring together a group of individuals, and somebody in that group may know something about it.

And they can tell you, they can give you information, or they can give you direct Internet links where you can find more information. The other source of information is some of the Us TOO publications, our monthly hot sheet, as well as the website.

There are a couple other websites that I personally regard as excellent. The first would be the Prostate Cancer Foundation. The second would be Prostate Cancer Research Institute. And then finally, ZERO. So, I think if you attend a support group, and talk to other guys, and look at some of these websites, I think that’s a very good starting point for research and trying to get the best and most up-to-date information possible.

There’s a lot of progress being made across the disease spectrum, and it’s very exciting. I mean, for many years, all we had was surgery, radiation, and hormone therapy. But new things are coming online all the time. There are immunotherapies that are frequently genetically based. And there’s new knowledge about the disease itself and making active surveillance available to more patients.

And this is extremely critical because many men can go on with prostate cancer, with low-grade disease, really for their entire lives, and avoid the side effects of treatment.

And even if they don’t, if they delay definitive treatment for a period of years, there may be something new that comes down the pike that is both effective and has a better side-effect profile. This is the kind of research that is a part of what Prostate Cancer Foundation is funding.

So, there’s a lot out there. There’s a lot that’s happening. And I think that should give encouragement to prostate cancer patients. In terms of somebody who is later in the process and having difficulty coping with side effects or disease progression, I think the encouragement is that there are people out there that you can talk to about it, that you’re really not alone, and there are people out there that are anxious to help you, to hear from you, and provide assistance.

For those of us who have been at it a while, we find that helping others enhances our own healing. And so, don’t be reticent about asking for help. Because it’s out there, and it can really make a difference.

How Could You Benefit from Joining a Prostate Cancer Support Group?

How Could You Benefit from Joining a Prostate Cancer Support Group? from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

What are some of the benefits provided by prostate cancer support groups? Prostate cancer survivor Jim Schraidt shares his perspective on how support groups can help patients with the emotional aspects of the disease as well as serve as a resource for information sharing.

Jim Schraidt is a prostate cancer survivor and Chairman of the Board of Directors for Us TOO International. Learn more about Jim Schraidt here.

See more from The Pro-Active Prostate Cancer Patient Toolkit

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Transcript:

Jim Schraidt:              

I think there are two primary ways that support groups are helpful. In the best case, a man will come to a support group as a newly diagnosed patient. And we’re actually working with a pilot project at Northwestern in Chicago where we have a support group that’s been in existence for a little over a year at this point.

But one of things that we’re working with the urology department there on is to get the urologists to refer newly diagnosed patients to the support group. And I think the primary benefits to a newly diagnosed patient are first, sort of removing some of the anxiety by talking to people who have been through the process and reminding them that in 90 percent of the cases they have some time to do some research, talk to people, and make a good decision that they can live with.

Because all of the treatments for prostate cancer, with the possible exception of active surveillance, come with side effects that a person undergoing this kind of treatment is going to have to live with for the rest of this life.

So, it’s a decision that’s very important. And to have the best possible outcome for a patient, they need to know what those side effects are. And they need to hear from men who have actually been through it.

I think the second important function of support groups is just support; after treatment, or if a patient is unfortunate enough to have recurrence or progression of his disease. And we’re not practitioners. We’re not medical practitioners. We don’t give medical advice. But there are lots of tricks of the trade, if you will, that men who have been coping with side effects can share with other men and help them get through it.

And part of that is just having a place to talk about what they’re going through, whether it’s things that they’re embarrassed to talk with their friends about, or things where they’re having difficulty communicating with their partner. I know from experience also that anger is a big thing that many patients experience, anger, and depression, post-treatment. And for me, one of the huge benefits of a support group was finding a place where that anger could go.

Because, I mean, even the best and most well-intentioned spouse, partner, or whatever, is going to grow tired of an angry patient partner.

And that can impact communication and can isolate a patient. So, it’s really important to have a place where some of that can go. And that’s part of the second piece, as far as I’m concerned.

The whole mental health piece really is under-emphasized, under-discussed by practitioners, but is very real for a lot of men undergoing this treatment. And the good news is that, that there is help available, and you can get through this. But many, many, many times you can’t do it on your own.

And you can’t do it solely with the help of your partner many times. So, this is one way you can talk to other people who have been through it, and they may have suggestions about therapy or talking to mental health practitioners.

How Does Us TOO International Support Prostate Cancer Patients and Their Loved Ones?

How Does Us TOO International Support Prostate Cancer Patients and Their Loved Ones? from Patient Empowerment Network on Vimeo.

What are the ways that Us TOO International can help prostate cancer patients and their loved ones? Jim Schraidt, a prostate cancer survivor and chairman of Us TOO’s board of directors shares how his involvement with support groups evolved after his diagnosis and how Us TOO is working to improve support for both patients and care partners.

Jim Schraidt is a prostate cancer survivor and Chairman of the Board of Directors for Us TOO International. Learn more about Jim Schraidt here.

See more from The Pro-Active Prostate Cancer Patient Toolkit

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Newly Diagnosed with Prostate Cancer? Consider These Key Steps

How Can You Insist on Better Prostate Cancer Care?


Transcript:

Jim Schraidt:              

My name is Jim Schraidt. I am now a 10-year, almost 11-year prostate cancer survivor. I was diagnosed in January of 2010 and had surgery in March of that year. Since then I’ve been involved in various support groups and some of those activities.

I found my way to a support group probably about three or four months after I was treated. And I was very active in that support group for a number of years. They helped me with a number of issues I was having at the time. And eventually I went on to become the facilitator of that group, and I’ve been in that role now for about five years.

Us TOO helped me find my initial support group. And we currently sponsor a network, a nationwide network of about 200 support groups. I became very interested in the work that Us TOO was doing, and I ran for Board, their Board of Directors. And I was elected, and I’m now finishing my sixth year on the Board and my second year as Chairman of that Board.

So, we’ve been very active in looking at the entire prostate cancer community and trying to develop new and better ways to serve patients. One of the things that we’ve accomplished in the last couple years is a partnership with a prostate cancer foundation, with is the leading private-research funder of prostate cancer research. So, we’ve worked with them to help make education about clinical trials available, for example. And they are contributing to our monthly newsletter with research news that’s actually put in laymen’s language so that people can understand it.

We’ve collaborated with other prostate cancer organizations, and we believe that this is critically important, that by working together we can amplify the patient voice and develop the best possible educational materials. So, in addition to the support groups, we have that going on. We also have a website that has a great deal of information about prostate cancer, support groups, and that sort of thing.

We are the prostate cancer sponsor for the Inspire site, which is an online community where prostate cancer patients can type in a question and have that question answered by other prostate cancer patients, or people who are knowledgeable in the field.

We actually have some practitioners that occasionally check in on that. So, then I think the final thing is that we have a couple of dial-in support groups that are for subspecialty types of patients and caregivers.

The first is called A Forum for Her, and it’s exclusively for women partners and caregivers. It gives them a separate and safe place to go and talk about the disease from a woman’s perspective. And then the second, newer dial-in support group we have is for gay men. And this is a group of men that for various reasons are less comfortable than they need to be in a broader kind of support group.

So, we’re working on that as well. One of our key initiatives as we look to celebrating our 30th year next year is support group leader education. And the goal here is to teach support group leaders best practices and make resources available to them so that they can either direct patients where to find information, or they can go back and find information and give that to patients directly.

So, the goal, once again, is to bring some standardization to the support group experience, and make sure that men are getting the best possible support and information.